Deadend

What it should be called is Utopia.

Viking

On the other hand....I've read many of the posts in various sections of the Forum. Can you imagine the arguments some of our kind could muster in Nogodland in support of, or against, any proposal that was not FULLY reasoned, objective, and empirical?? I have a rather lofty IQ and a Masters to go along with it and feel like a drooling fool next to some of these folks!

openeyes

Unfortunately, it's been brought home to me this past year that we atheists are awfully dang human and capable of some pretty questionable behavior. I think it may be a little optimistic to call an atheist homeland "Utopia". Nonetheless, it sure would be interesting to see what a society would be like without all this myth and superstition.

[ December 16, 2002: Message edited by: openeyes ]</p>

Radorth

Er, like Russia in the 60's? It wasn't too bad, as long as you kept your opinions to yourself, and enjoyed standing in line.

How about China?

Rad

openeyes

You're concluding obviously, that atheism was the cause of these countries' problems? Seems to be some faulty logic at work if you ask me.

{fixed tag -T.}

[ December 16, 2002: Message edited by: Toto ]</p>

Abacus

Equating atheism with communism, eh? You really should know better by now.

Chuck

If you're going to equate atheism with communism, at least do it well. Bread lines were largely a thing of the past by the 1960s. Brezhnev's rule, 1964-1982, were pretty good years for the USSR. Quality of life was higher than the Soviet Union had ever known, goods were available, a middle class (thought not necessarily in the capitalist sense of the word - class was not determined so much by ownership of things) emerged.

Politically, the country stagnated. But socially, in the new middle class, a dynamic and insightful debate was taking place about the future of the country. And yes, there was censorship in place. But nothing like the Stalin era.

Of course, the economic policies of Brezhnev weren't that great, and consumer prices stayed unchanged because the state absorbed a lot of economic blows.

Anyway, if you're going to compare atheism with communism, use the first Five-Year Plan (1928-1932) period. No food, crash industrialization. Then, in 1937-1938, the height of his paranoid Ezhovschina. Did I mention that Stalin was a theology student? Or war communism under Lenin. Those were hard times.

Or maybe the period following the capitalist revolution? There were breadlines then.

So amend that section of your "Christian's Guide to Logic and History." I guess they do concise Soviet history in the second edition.

Chuck

Edited because I can't spell.

[ December 16, 2002: Message edited by: Chuck Fristians ]</p>