Freethought & Rationalism Archive

ax · 03-18-2003, 01:17 AM

I have never known another individual, who has reached this same point in life (as me), other than inkblott.
I'm refering to self awareness. It's very hard to explain, but I'll try. (Hey inkblott, feel like helping me out here?) I'm sure we are all aware of our own existances, but we all seem to harbour an original mind. From research and personal experience, it seems as though death is only a door. Have you ever been fully aware of you, stuck in a moment? And you think to yourself, "who is this person? This is not MY body". It's as though you become detached from yourself, and become an observer. It's as though I'm aware of 2 beings, who are one. One is an eternal being, the other is temporary. One side of me is the everyday being, the other is an observer to what "I" do. It seems that death is not the end. But a door. And you must be aware of your own self, to be ready for death. Scarmutt and I have had some very powerful spiritual experiences. Ones involving revelations and such. Others involving tourterous spectral beings. They are all things that convince me of an afterlife. But I'm just wondering if any one else here is "self aware".

Entropic_Gnosis · 03-18-2003, 07:46 PM

every so often i get this shock of the idea of the self . . .sort of a "wait a second I am existing, I am acting . . . .wierd" its like seeing yourself in the 3rd person . . .very strange it is too

philechat · 03-18-2003, 08:00 PM

There is an "afterlife"--only that we do not keep our identity. I don't think it would be reward/punishment based as what the theists claimed...but rather, from imagining the universe expanding not once, which would include the possibility of "self" to emerge again...with different properties from the "I" in this life.

I know I don't make sense. But in a more naturalistic way we could also imagine our body changing to different forms...a metamorphosis of sorts, the continuous exchange of its atomic structures throughout our life and after we "die".

For good reasons I am very suspicious of the conventional afterlife--it resembles too much the invention of human wishful thinking and resentment. But other forms of afterlife (such as non-karmic "reincarnation" or existence as some kind of inhuman form) might be possible...for all sentient creatures I mean...

03-18-2003, 09:29 PM

It seems that death is not the end. But a door. And you must be aware of your own self, to be ready for death.

Life is not Eternal And Death is not an End.

However, knowing your Self is not necessary means you will die ... it simply means you have stop running.

HelenM · 03-19-2003, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ax
Scarmutt and I have had some very powerful spiritual experiences. Ones involving revelations and such. Others involving tourterous spectral beings.

Were these while you were a Christian, or after?

Is Scarmutt someone else who posts here?

Helen

Glass*Soul · 03-19-2003, 07:22 AM

I've battled depression on and off at various times in my life. One thing that I've found helpful is to realize that there is an aspect of my psyche that is an Observer who is not effected by the depression. This observer is always present and beautifully detached. I would like to be able to step even more fully into her "skin" at will.

One other thing I would like to throw into the conversation, although I'm not sure if it is entirely relevant, is that there also seems to me to be an aspect of my psyche that is always in the dream state. It is as though sleep allows me to access dreams that are alreading taking place... as if I step into the action while it is already under way.

Both InK.Blott and ScaR.Mutt sound like interesting people. Perhaps I'll meet them some day...

Jamie_L · 03-19-2003, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ax
It seems that death is not the end. But a door.

Unfortunately, in my experience, what seems to be true and what is actually true sometimes have little or no relationship with each other.

Deja vu seems to be remembering something that is happening now. However, it is only a brain glitch causing perception to "seem" like a memory when it isn't. Humans should be careful when it comes to relying on their perceptions of illusive traits like "memory" and "self".

Jamie

Eudaimonist · 03-19-2003, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ax
Have you ever been fully aware of you, stuck in a moment? And you think to yourself, "who is this person? This is not MY body". It's as though you become detached from yourself, and become an observer. It's as though I'm aware of 2 beings, who are one.

Yes, I've experienced that, but I don't take it as proof of an immortal soul any more than I take the experience of falling in love as proof of the existence of Cupid. It seems to me that you are engaged in wishful thinking.

Glass*Soul · 03-19-2003, 08:26 AM

Well, I don't take this "Observer" self as proof of an immortal soul, but it is interesting. I might go so far as to say it could be taken to imply an immortal soul. The sheer detachment of this aspect of my being is my main interest in it. It stands aside in even the most emotional, out of control moments.

In fact, it occurs to me in making this response, that I am now observing the Observer.

03-18-2003, 01:17 AM	#1
ax Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: In your mind! Posts: 289	Reflections on self. I have never known another individual, who has reached this same point in life (as me), other than inkblott. I'm refering to self awareness. It's very hard to explain, but I'll try. (Hey inkblott, feel like helping me out here?) I'm sure we are all aware of our own existances, but we all seem to harbour an original mind. From research and personal experience, it seems as though death is only a door. Have you ever been fully aware of you, stuck in a moment? And you think to yourself, "who is this person? This is not MY body". It's as though you become detached from yourself, and become an observer. It's as though I'm aware of 2 beings, who are one. One is an eternal being, the other is temporary. One side of me is the everyday being, the other is an observer to what "I" do. It seems that death is not the end. But a door. And you must be aware of your own self, to be ready for death. Scarmutt and I have had some very powerful spiritual experiences. Ones involving revelations and such. Others involving tourterous spectral beings. They are all things that convince me of an afterlife. But I'm just wondering if any one else here is "self aware".

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03-18-2003, 07:46 PM	#2
Entropic_Gnosis Regular Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Library Posts: 372	every so often i get this shock of the idea of the self . . .sort of a "wait a second I am existing, I am acting . . . .wierd" its like seeing yourself in the 3rd person . . .very strange it is too

03-18-2003, 08:00 PM	#3
philechat Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Mind of the Other Posts: 886	There is an "afterlife"--only that we do not keep our identity. I don't think it would be reward/punishment based as what the theists claimed...but rather, from imagining the universe expanding not once, which would include the possibility of "self" to emerge again...with different properties from the "I" in this life. I know I don't make sense. But in a more naturalistic way we could also imagine our body changing to different forms...a metamorphosis of sorts, the continuous exchange of its atomic structures throughout our life and after we "die". For good reasons I am very suspicious of the conventional afterlife--it resembles too much the invention of human wishful thinking and resentment. But other forms of afterlife (such as non-karmic "reincarnation" or existence as some kind of inhuman form) might be possible...for all sentient creatures I mean...

03-18-2003, 09:29 PM	#4
Seraphim Guest Posts: n/a	It seems that death is not the end. But a door. And you must be aware of your own self, to be ready for death. Life is not Eternal And Death is not an End. However, knowing your Self is not necessary means you will die ... it simply means you have stop running.

03-19-2003, 07:22 AM	#6
Glass*Soul Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Beneath the Tree of Knowlege of Good and Evil. Posts: 985	I've battled depression on and off at various times in my life. One thing that I've found helpful is to realize that there is an aspect of my psyche that is an Observer who is not effected by the depression. This observer is always present and beautifully detached. I would like to be able to step even more fully into her "skin" at will. One other thing I would like to throw into the conversation, although I'm not sure if it is entirely relevant, is that there also seems to me to be an aspect of my psyche that is always in the dream state. It is as though sleep allows me to access dreams that are alreading taking place... as if I step into the action while it is already under way. Both InK.Blott and ScaR.Mutt sound like interesting people. Perhaps I'll meet them some day...

03-19-2003, 08:26 AM	#9
Glass*Soul Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Beneath the Tree of Knowlege of Good and Evil. Posts: 985	Well, I don't take this "Observer" self as proof of an immortal soul, but it is interesting. I might go so far as to say it could be taken to imply an immortal soul. The sheer detachment of this aspect of my being is my main interest in it. It stands aside in even the most emotional, out of control moments. In fact, it occurs to me in making this response, that I am now observing the Observer.

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