Valentine Pontifex

Today's scarry reading:

<a href="http://www.leg.wa.gov/pub/billinfo/2001-02/Senate/6500-6524/6500_01182002.txt" target="_blank">http://www.leg.wa.gov/pub/billinfo/2001-02/Senate/6500-6524/6500_01182002.txt</a>

Look at the last paragraph, the in effect,
bans evolution from schools and mandates
creationism.

I got it listed at <a href="http://www.fark.com" target="_blank">www.fark.com</a>

But to my horror, when I tried to post a comment to their board, it told me I had to wait 24 hours. If I had known this I would have signed up a while back in case of need. If there are any registered "Farkers" feel free to post my attempted post on the relevent thread:

[code]
The National Center for Science Education has a brief
&lt;a href="http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/news/2002/WA/458_new_antievolution_legislation_1_23_2002.asp"&g t;
story about this&lt;/a&gt;.
&lt;p&gt;
For those who want to do something about this:
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;a href="http://www.ncseweb.org"&gt;Join the National Center
for Science Education&lt;/a&gt; -- the only national organization
whose sole purpose the fight against creationism and to
defend the teaching of evolution in the schools.
&lt;p&gt;
The NCSE and the American Institute of Biological
Sciences have set up low volume moderated list serves (e-mailing
lists) for most of the states so citizens of those states
can keep informed about creationist activities in their
state.
&lt;p&gt;
The NCSE has an
&lt;a href=
"http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/4633_ten_tips_for_letter_hacking_3_19_2001.asp" &gt;short article&lt;/a&gt;
that gives advice on making an effective letter to the editor.
&lt;p&gt;
Those who want to learn about the fallacies the creationists
use should check out the
&lt;a href="http://www.talkorigins.org"&gt;The Talk.Origins
Archive&lt;/a&gt; explores the Creation/Evolution debate from
a viewpoint of mainstream science and is a depository
of many pro-evolution or anti-creationism FAQs and articles.
It has just added a few articles.
</pre>[/quote]

[ January 24, 2002: Message edited by: theyeti ]</p>

BLoggins02

yes, I saw this. I'm still in shock (although I don't know why, this kind of thing seems to be happening more and more lately.

OK, that's nice. What does the state Constitution have to do with the teaching of evolution?

Since when is a 250 year old document the authority on scientific truth? I'll bet Senator Hochstatter thinks it was written by a Christian too

And therefore we also do hereby affirm that we are an accomplice to the Sole source of authority on scientific truth, also known as the Declaration of Independence.

Except, of course, the right to have a decent education free from religious and superstitious nonsense. If the rest of the world isn't laughing at us by now, they should be.

Here we go again. Let's ban a scientific theory from being taught in our schools and replace it with our particular tale of creationism because we want to uphold political, civil, and religious liberty <img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" />

The were instituted to protect HUMAN rights. If evolution "created" humans, then evolution is the "Creator" of human rights. I don't see the problem

Ain't that spiffy

On the other hand, the legislature finds that the teaching of the fable of one particular creation story out of the thousands that exist is perfectly lawful because that's what Jefferson MUST have been referring to when he wrote "Creator", I mean, Jefferson was Christian right? <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

And since no credible textbooks exist on creation science without making numerous biblical references and appeals to emotion over evidence, we are hereby singlehandedly tearing down the wall between church and state and replacing all of those heretical "science" textbooks with Bibles.

CodeMason

Today, Congress seems to be focussing more and more on what Constitutional right it can manage to violate today. It's Brave New World meets 1984 meets the Dark Ages.

But I'm not too worried about this one, there's precedent ruling it unconstitutional, and there will be a massive revolt from the scientific community and human rights groups if it's passed.

BLoggins02

I emailed the nice senator from Washington and informed him as such. I even dropped in a convenient URL where he could read the Supreme Court's ruling that the teaching of 'creation science' "offered no secular purpose"

LeftCoast

Any moron of a legislator can file any bill that he pleases. That does not mean that the committee even has to take it up much less that it will ever get to the floor for a full vote.

What will be telling will be the treatment that the bill receives in committee and where it goes from here. It's probably nothing more than some fundie-fruit-loop-of-a-legislator appealing to his base.

Writer@Large

This is babbling bullshit if for no other reason than it tries to place some sort of legal and/or political authority in the Declaration of Independance--a document which has absolutely *no* legal or political standing. It's a damn *essay*, not a contract!

--W@L

theyeti

There's a thread in C/S separation about it <a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=59&t=000036" target="_blank">here</a> Oh, and Lord Valentine, could you try to fix your code? I'm not sure whether or not you want it that way so that people can cut and paste, but it's weirding the page.

theyeti

P.S. I went ahead and hit return for the offending line to restore the page.

[ January 24, 2002: Message edited by: theyeti ]</p>

bluefugue

Yeah, I also hate it when people act as though the Declaration is somehow legally binding. I think Dubya made a comment that included that blunder at some point during his campaign, but I can't remember what it was...

Ernest Sparks

This bill is a HOOT!
Safely dies in committee, I'm sure!

what about its writer?
<a href="http://www.src.wa.gov/members/hochstatter.htm" target="_blank">Senator Harold Hochstatter Republican - Moses Lake 13th Legislative District</a>

Ever been to Moses Lake? I recommend July.

S2Focus

Haven't been to Moses Lake proper, but about 8 years ago I drove through a little town not far from Moses Lake. I stopped a little cafe for lunch there. As I was eating lunch, I overheard a conversation taking place in the booth behind me. Two farmers were bitching about how the Clinton administration was cutting back on their government-subsidized water allocations (to save salmon for pinko invarnmentalists). It's rather interesting to see how so many western right-wing anti-government fanatics are so dependent upon big government welfare (paid for by liberal city-slicker taxpayers), but I digress....

The conversation wandered from Clinton and Babbit to the then-agriculture-secretary Michael Espy. The exchange went something as follows:

Government-subsidized-farmer #1: That $%#@! Babbit wants to take away all of our water for some $#**&!@! fish! I hate those god-damned Clinton administration socialists!

Government-subsidized-farmer #2: Yeah, and what about that agriculture secretary Espy? He's a ni**er!! What does he know about farming?

Government-subsidized-farmer #1: I'll bet his father picked cotton!

These are exactly the kind of folks that Senator Harold Hochstatter is pandering to by pushing his anti-evolution legislation. But in a way, I cannot really blame Hochstatter. After all, if your constituents are a bunch of government-subsidized anti-government fundie rednecks, this is what you have to do to get re-elected!