Soyin Milka

Ruy Lopez's ideas make more sense now that I stopped chkcling stupidly. Lack of an organised indigenous group fits well with what happened in Irak. Perhaps the hawks were hoping the iraki exiles they sent back with american forces (Like Chalabi) would provide a good substitute?

I wonder if the americans could have done much to prevent looting without risking looking like conquerors. I'm not convinced the irakis place much trust in the americans. Seeing them guarding treasures could have triggered angry reactions maybe...

Not that I excuse the way the way looting was handled. I lost it when I heard the hospitals had been looted. It just made humanitarian relief seem so far. I'm saddened by the lost artefacts in the museum but the ill and wounded people ... Urgh ... The looters took disinfectant, pain-killers and antibiotics. I can't understand that it was allowed to go on while the ministry of oil was guarded by american soldiers...

Bah.

Soyin

Dr Rick

The US military is not well-versed in civilian police duties; it is a fighting-force, and would have quite possibly resorted to violence if ordered to stop the looters. That is what militaries are supposed to do when fighting starts.

Maybe if some of the paramilitary forces and snipers had taken advantage of the target oppurtunities afforded by a military working to control looters, there could have been a (bigger) bloodbath.

Maybe the military could have restrained the looting, but maybe we could then be posting on the deaths and brutality they had inflicted as they did so.

The looting and the tragedy it brought was predictable; the outcome and death toll if the military had intervened is not.

Rick

Vorkosigan

But Dr. Rick, what the media has not really brought out is that the looting has resulted in violence leading to deaths. If several of the looters had been ruthlessly shot promptly and early, not only would much private property have been spared, but many people's lives would have been as well.

Further, looting wrecks the basis for a functioning economy. And a dysfunctional economy will kill a lot more people than shooting a few looters or even vigilante justice.

Vorkosigan

Daggah

Didn't stop them from intervening in front of the Iraqi Oil Ministry, that's for damn sure!

And you would think a doctor would be a little less apologetic for the U.S. military when considering it didn't bother defending hospitals from looting, either!

Dr Rick

Maybe, or maybe not; I just don't know. Nor do I know what the reaction and outcry would have been if soldiers had ruthlessly and promptly opened fire on looters, or if scores of soldiers had returned fire on snipers as they worked to control crowds of looters.

I just don't know what course of action would have caused less deaths, or what would have given us a better outcome.

"I wasn't there [when the looting took place], and I don't know what the situation was, but I do know what's at stake. The need for policing should have been obvious. If it was impossible to do, then I'm sympathetic; if it wasn't, then I'm really irritated." Archaeologist and art historian John Russell, of the Massachusetts College of Art.

I'm not apologizing for the military; if you are aware of something that would have definitely made for a better outcome that neither Dr Russell nor I know, please share it.

Rick

CALDONIA

In Donald Rumsfeld's view, there wasn't any looting, just 'some guy stealing a vase, reported over and over by the media.' The fallback position is that the ONLY looting was of government (regime) offices and homes. A lie.

Rummy finally dismissed the situation as "untidiness" that must accompany liberation.

Of course, it must makes some difference that the property being looted, damaged and burned was not American property.

I figure we'll "install" our democracy with strings (cables?) attached in a month or two and go home.

The glorious war will be on DVD before September.

Daggah

Wow, you completely avoided what I said.

If the U.S. military can afford to post a small force of marines and armored vehicles in front of the Iraqi Oil Ministry, surely they can post 5 soldiers with rifles on a patrol of the museum?

MrDarwin

I think we should post signs prominently in all the cities around the world, "Weapons of Mass Destruction Will Not Be Tolerated."

Enlighten Me

"POKING FUN AT ENLIGHTENED LADY'S STUPID SIGN IDEA WILL NOT BE TOLERATED!"

Dr Rick

You can judge that at least as well as I can.

I really wasn't there when the looting took place, and I don't know what the situation was, but I do that hospitals are vital. The need for policing should have been obvious. If it was impossible to do, then I can't condemn the military. If it wasn't, then I can.

Rick