Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Troll Hunter · 03-10-2002, 01:34 PM

[CUE manly theme music and opening credits.]

[WIPE TO: STEVE, in the deep, dank dusty bowels of a library; stacks of books can be seen on either side. There's no power down here, so Steve finds his way along with a FLASHLIGHT, the spiffy halogen kind they use on THE X-FILES and CSI. Thick motes of dust drift through the beam.]

G'day, and welcome to a special episode of TROLL HUNTER! There's a wily and loquacious new troll running rampant through the E/C/ forums, a newly evolved species I've tentatively labeled trollus quotitatus. Instead of chasing this verbose and repetitious bugger across the boards, I decided to start a new thread, so you all know where to go for the funny

.

I�m here in the lower levels of the library at the University of Wallamaloo, trying to help trollus quotitatus over his quotation fixation by tracking down the context of some of his favorite quotes. I asked the friendly librarian at the desk, Shirlene, for some assistance, and she�s sent me down here, �to the stacks.� Why, you ask? Well, just take a look at the sources of some of the favorite quotes of the trollus quotitatus.

[STEVE begins to thumb through the stacks, and the camera looks over his shoulder. As he pulls old tomes from the shelves, we see:

Quote:

[George Gaylord Simpson (evolutionist), The Major Features of Evolution, New York, Columbia University Press, 1953 p. 360.]

[David B. Kitts (evolutionist), "Search for the Holy Transformation," Paleobiology, Vol. 5 (Summer 1979), pp. 353-354.]

[S.J. Gould & Niles Eldredge (evolutionists); Paleobiology 3:147, 1977]

[S.J. Gould (evolutionist); Natural History 86:14 (1977)]

[Steven M. Stanley, Macroevolution and the Fossil Record, Vol. 36, No. 3, 1986, p. 460. (emphasis added)]

[Steven M. Stanley, Macroevolution: Pattern and Process. San Francisco: W. M. Freeman & Co., 1979, p. 39.]

[Ronald R. West (evolutionist), �Paleontology and Uniformitariansim.� Compass, Vol. 45 (May 1968), p. 216.]

[E.R. Leach (evolutionist); Nature 293:19, 1981]

As Steve finishes with the last one, he slams the book shut, sending a cloud of dust into the air.]

Cough! Cough! See? The context--hack! Wheeze!--the context of these quotes is--hack! Cough! � �scuse me, mates �

[STEVE ducks off camera. There is a momentary fit of hacking and coughing, followed by a discharge of phlegm.]

[STEVE reappears, smiling.]

Sorry; dust allergy. Anyways, the context of these quotes is, quite simply, an old one, regardless of any other contextual concerns. The trollus quotitatus only found one quote less than 20 years old, and that one�s still 15 years� past. Crikey, I�ve learned a lot about *crocs* in that time, never mind evolution! Even if these quite popular scientific minds aren�t being quoted out of context, is it possible they�ve learned nothing over the past 20-plus years?

Let�s go see what they�re saying nowadays, shall we?

[CUT TO: STEVE, now on the main floor of the library. The stacks are neat and clean, the lights are on, and Steve sits before a COMPUTER, accessing an online journal database. A pretty blonde sits in his lap.]

We�re up on the main floor of the library at the University of Wallamaloo, where I�ve asked the lovely Shirlene here to show me around the electronic databases and catalogs. And with her help, I�ve found just a few interesting things.

[STEVE punches a few keys, and the camera CUTS TO a feed from the library catalog. We see:

Quote:

�Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts do not go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's, but apples did not suspend themselves in mid-air, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from apelike ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other, yet to be discovered.� [S.J. Gould (scientist), from Hen's Teeth and Horse's Toes (1994).]

�Ironically, at the very end of this millennium (I am writing this essay in late November 1999), demotions, warnings, and anathemas have again come into vogue in several regions of our nation. The Kansas school board has reduced evolution, the central and unifying concept of the life sciences, to an optional subject within the state's biology curriculm--an educational ruling akin to stating that English will still be taught but that grammar may henceforth be regared as a peripheral frill, permitted but not mandated as a classroom subject.� [S.J. Gould, (scientist), Natural History 28-44 109, no. 1 (Feb 2000): 28-44.]

�This simple prediction--that there is one grand pattern of similarity linking all life--doesn�t prove evolution, but only because science proceeds by falsifying--disproving--statements we make about how the universe is structured and how it behaves. But we gain tremendous confidence in our statements if, after hundreds of years, everything we have devised to test an idea fails to falsify it. And so the failure of scientists to disprove evolution over the past 200 years of biological research means that the fundamental idea that life has evolved really is one of the few grand ideas of biology that has stood the test of time. This basic notion of evolution is thoroughly scientific in the strictest sense of the word, and as such is as highly corroborated and at least as powerful as the notion of gravity or the idea that the Earth is round, spins on its axis, and revolves around the sun.� [Niles Eldredge (scientist), The Triumph of Evolution and the Failure of Creationism. W.H. Freeman and Company, 2000: 31.]

I could go on. For example, Stephen Stanley, despite his apparent (and out of context) �denial� of evolution in the 1970s and 1980s, is still publishing about Ice Age extinction and speciation in the Journal of Paleontology, and hundreds of other scientists are publishing articles supporting evolution in journals worldwide. But what�s the point of continuing? The trollus quotitatus will continue to claim he�s won (<a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=58&t=000370&p=2" target="_blank">�As far as the fossil record goes, this is game,set, and match. I will now go over and shake your hand as you acknowledge full defeat�</a>) based on a piddly few old quotations, and my mates on the E/C boards will continue to bang their heads against the wall of his stubborn ignorance.

Well, folks, I�m done for now, but I�ll certainly continue to track the movements of the wiley trollus quotitatus, and I�ll be sure to bring all the best highlights and comments to you here on �

TROLL HUNTER!!!!!!

[CUE manly theme music and end credits.]

[ March 10, 2002: Message edited by: Troll Hunter ]

Pantera · 03-10-2002, 01:37 PM

Coragyps · 03-10-2002, 01:44 PM

My favorite part:

Quote:

S.J. Gould (scientist),

Well hunted!!!

Late_Cretaceous · 03-10-2002, 01:56 PM

Methinks Randy-man must be cowaring under a bridge somewhere right now. But then again he may verywell come forth with a statement like "that prooves nothing". Hey, if someone wants to believe the sky is orange with pink polkadots they will believe it no matter what.

Excellent work BTW Troll Hunter.

bonduca · 03-10-2002, 02:03 PM

RufusAtticus · 03-10-2002, 02:14 PM

Mad Kally · 03-10-2002, 02:21 PM

Dear Troll Hunter,

I LOVE YOU!

Kally

Megatron · 03-10-2002, 04:47 PM

Yay! Troll Hunter!! <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Can't wait till the next episode!

Peez · 03-11-2002, 10:43 AM

<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Peez

The_Gorgonzola · 03-11-2002, 10:55 AM

TH,

You should do a whole series of these. Then get with a decent artist and make them into comics. Sort like Chick tracts (ahem

) for science (of course unlike Chick tracts you us actual data and real scientific prinicaples)! I think you would make a mint!!!

Keep on keeping on!

Gorgo

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03-10-2002, 01:37 PM	#2
Pantera Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Cambridge, England, but a Scot at heart Posts: 2,431	<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

03-10-2002, 01:56 PM	#4
Late_Cretaceous Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Alberta Posts: 1,049	Methinks Randy-man must be cowaring under a bridge somewhere right now. But then again he may verywell come forth with a statement like "that prooves nothing". Hey, if someone wants to believe the sky is orange with pink polkadots they will believe it no matter what. Excellent work BTW Troll Hunter.

03-10-2002, 02:03 PM	#5
bonduca Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: . Posts: 1,653	<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

03-10-2002, 02:14 PM	#6
RufusAtticus Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NCSU Posts: 5,853

03-10-2002, 02:21 PM	#7
Mad Kally Banned Join Date: May 2001 Location: LALA Land in California Posts: 3,764	Dear Troll Hunter, I LOVE YOU! Kally

03-10-2002, 04:47 PM	#8
Megatron Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: New York Posts: 5,441	Yay! Troll Hunter!! <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> Can't wait till the next episode!

03-11-2002, 10:43 AM	#9
Peez Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Canada Posts: 5,504	<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> Peez

03-11-2002, 10:55 AM	#10
The_Gorgonzola Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: California Posts: 37	TH, You should do a whole series of these. Then get with a decent artist and make them into comics. Sort like Chick tracts (ahem ) for science (of course unlike Chick tracts you us actual data and real scientific prinicaples)! I think you would make a mint!!! Keep on keeping on! Gorgo

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