davidm

In Dowa, a village in Malwai, the Sunday N.Y. Times reports that 14 people have already died from hunger-related illnesses because of a drought. The story tells of a woman and her "four ragged children" who have no more food. The woman sold the last of her possessions: Her goat, her umbrella, two metal plates and a pail. Still no rain or food. Now she is praying: "I was praying for the rains. I was praying for god to give me food."

Questions for Christians and Muslims: Will it rain soon in Malwai? If not, why not? And if it doesn't, and the woman and her four children die in agony, will all of them then be cast into eternal fire, because they prayed to the wrong god?

seebs

I don't know if it will rain. I do, however, think that maybe there are alternatives other than waiting in that place for rain.

I'm in the "two boats and a helicopter" camp.

Tercel

Possibly. -I'm not omniscient! :b

I'm sure you don't need an explanation of the physical principles behind how weather works, even if I could give a good one.

How can you pray to the "wrong" god precisely? If only one God exists and she's praying to "God", then how can she be praying to the wrong one?
Are you suggesting here mental understanding of the God she is praying to might not exactly correspond to reality? In that case it sounds like we're all going to Hell since the Christian God's supposed to be beyond full human comprehension, and I wouldn't be surprised if the Muslims have similar doctrines.
Or perhaps her theology of God isn't quite up to scratch? Sounds like then she'll have a lot of company in Hell with all averagely ignorant Christians who wouldn't be able to explain the doctrine of the Trinity if their lives depended upon it.

All of which is to say: I hope you can see why I don't think the question is a very sensible one. Whatever happens in the afterlife is between her and God and is not for me to judge.


I'm in the "There might possibly be a boat or a helicopter, but if their isn't then it doesn't matter as life's only temporary anyway and we might not be able to control what comes our way, but we can control how we respond to it - so we should spend our time responding in love and compassion and making ourselves better people: and if I don't like what's happening then I'll make a note to talk to God about it in the afterlife and find out the whys and wherefores and in the meantime concentrate on making myself a better person and helping others" camp.

ManM

Why must it rain in Malawi? We have an abundance of resources (relative to them), so why don't we help them out ourselves? Let's not blame God for something we aren't doing ourselves.

Vorkosigan

This thread is generating so much cognitive dissonance, I heard it all the way in Taiwan. No doubt god and the world will let the Malawians starve, just like the last ten times.

davidm

Tercel, if it doesn't rain and these people starve, does that mean god ignored her prayers? Or -- as would seem to be the simpler conclusion -- it would imply that there is no god. That would be the most sensible conclusion of all, don't you feel?

"How can you pray to the wrong god, precisely?" You tell me. Christians say people praying to Allah will go to hell. Muslims say people praying to Jesus will go to hell. And on and on. How are the starving Malawians to sort out the competing claims, and come to the right conclusion as to who to pray to, so that they rains will fall, or, at least, they won't burn for eternity after they starve?

I agree with the last post: No doubt god and the world will let the Malawians starve.

Tercel

No. Given that I'm a Christian, it's unlikely that I would feel that way.

"Christians" say lots of things. I'm not responsible for what other people say.

Hayden

Does this mean that if a pantheist prays to multiple gods, that all of those prayers go to the only one that exists?

lpetrich

Which might best be interpreted as God saying:

"You should have acted like a f***ing ATHEIST!!!"

lpetrich

Tercel, what would you think about those southern-Indian villagers who married two donkeys in hopes of making a Rain God willing to send rain? Do you believe that that Rain God is the exact same entity as the Christian God?

(from an Internet Infidels recent News Wire story)

Also, Tercel, some Southwest American Indians would do rain dances in hope of getting the rain to fall. Do you think that they were doing this in honor of the exact same entity that you worship?

Of course, what can one lose by marrying some donkeys or dancing rain dances? If these practices cause the rain to come, then so much the better. If these practices don't, then one will have lost nothing.

And the same can be said of other gods who have been considered responsible for rain -- are they the exact same entity as the Christian God?