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Old 05-30-2007, 03:30 AM   #31
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It's a far cry from saying that one must be prejudiced against empirical evidence.
That's a very special meaning of bias. A meaning which nobody in this thread endorses - only you are claiming that we do.

Clearly, it is a prejudice in reading the bible if one has to believe in the bible to understand it.

Stop dodging this fact with more semantic games.
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Old 05-30-2007, 03:39 AM   #32
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It's a far cry from saying that one must be prejudiced against empirical evidence.
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That's a very special meaning of bias.
It's in precisely the context of the discussion.

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Clearly, it is a prejudice in reading the bible if one has to believe in the bible to understand it.
To properly understand how to play a violin, one has to play a violin. One cannot scream at a violin tutor that/who insists that you actually pick up a violin if you want to know how to play it.
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Old 05-30-2007, 03:41 AM   #33
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Then you can't say which, if any, are Christians.
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Umm, no. I can not say which ones are True Christians.
Quite so.

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But I don't think that Toto claims to be a Christian. That is the context, if you care to look.
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Toto's orignal statement was about Christians.
That's irrelevant, though.
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:05 AM   #34
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Clearly, it is a prejudice in reading the bible if one has to believe in the bible to understand it.
To properly understand how to play a violin, one has to play a violin. One cannot scream at a violin tutor that/who insists that you actually pick up a violin if you want to know how to play it.
To properly understand a book, one does not have to believe what it says. Neither do I have to believe that a violin is inspired by god to play it correctly. So your analogy is not only wrong, it's silly.
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:09 AM   #35
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Umm, no. I can not say which ones are True Christians.
Quite so.
Which does not bother me, since I think the term "True Christian" is meaningless.

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Quote:
Toto's orignal statement was about Christians.
That's irrelevant, though.
Why it's irrlevant? You asked if "one" believes in the holy spirit, "one" in general meaning people, not a single person (Toto in this case?).
And you are essentially telling Toto that his point was irrlevant, without explaining why.
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:09 AM   #36
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[QUOTE=Sven;4497064]
Quote:
Quote:
Clearly, it is a prejudice in reading the bible if one has to believe in the bible to understand it.
To properly understand how to play a violin, one has to play a violin. One cannot scream at a violin tutor that/who insists that you actually pick up a violin if you want to know how to play it.
Quote:
To properly understand a book, one does not have to believe what it says.
One may have to do precisely that. Who can say?
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:11 AM   #37
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[QUOTE=Sven;4497072]
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Umm, no. I can not say which ones are True Christians.
Quite so.
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Which does not bother me, since I think the term "True Christian" is meaningless.
But others don't, of course.
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:12 AM   #38
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That's a very special meaning of bias.
It's in precisely the context of the discussion.
Why do you keep claiming that we all mean something different than what we say we mean? That's not only silly, it's insulting.
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:13 AM   #39
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Oh my, this thread got mangled. I blundered with the quote function.

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Quote:
To properly understand a book, one does not have to believe what it says.
One may have to do precisely that. Who can say?
:huh: I've understood many books, several among them which I disagreed with.
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Old 05-30-2007, 04:14 AM   #40
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Which does not bother me, since I think the term "True Christian" is meaningless.
But others don't, of course.
Your point?
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