Dean Anderson

I've been looking through my Bibles at references to Hell, and I think that it is completely misinterpreted by most Christian denominations.

Here's what I have gleaned so far, from my examination of English translations and a couple of Hebrew and Greek transliterations (although my Hebrew and Greek are practically non-existent, so I am limited to searching these for the few words I recognise) - I am posting my findings here because I am looking for people to correct this where I have made mistakes in context or translation.

1) The first - and glaringly obvious, once you've noticed it - reference to Hell is a negative one in that Hell is not referenced in a place where it would be expected. In the Genesis 1 creation account, God splits the primal waters and forms Heaven and Earth from them. No mention is made of the formation/creation of hell. If hell is so important to God's creation and cosmology and plans for the universe, you would think he would have mentioned its creation.

2) The second set of references are in the early OT. These refer to 'Sheol', (a.k.a. 'The Pit' or sometimes 'The Grave'), They are in Numbers 16 (where the ground opens up and Korah and his followers fall into Sheol), Deuteronomy 32 (where God is so angry he starts a fire that will burn the Earth and mountains, even down to the lowest hell) and in 2 Samuel 22 (where David describes being captured and surrounded by his enemies as being surrounded by the 'sorrows of hell'). These references imply that Sheol is a physical place that exists beneath the Earth, and that it is a place of sorrow.

3) The third set of references are in the book of Job. Again, these imply that Sheol is a physical place beneath the Earth (c.f. Job 11). However, Job17 and Job33 imply that it is a place where people's souls can dwell - both during their life and also after death. God can rescue people from there. This is not just a 'rescue' as in 'stop them going there'. This is a 'rescue' as in 'bring them out of there' (c.f. Job33).

4) By far the largest set of references to Hell are in the Psalms. The Psalmist(s) agree with the earlier writers that Hell is a physical place below the ground (c.f. Psalm 139, which interestingly states that God is present in Hell - neatly skewering the Christian argument that Hell is the absence of God). The Psalmist(s) also agree with Job that people's souls dwell there at times during their lives as well as after death, and can be rescued by God (c.f. Psalms 30, 40, 86 and 88). Psalm 116 interestingly says that the Psalmist's soul was dead and in Hell until God rescued it - which gives an impression of a religious belief where the soul can be alive or dead independently of the body/mind, although this may be just metaphor.

5) The book of Proverbs also contains many mixed and contrasting references to Hell. It claims (Proverbs 1) that people go bodily to hell (which agrees with the earlier 'Hell is a physical place' references. Proverbs 5, 7 and 9 are very obtuse passages, but they seem to say that Wisdom personified (Sophia) is a temptress who went to Hell after she died and now lures other people there. In Proverbs 15 we are again told that people can leave hell if they are wise (so presumably they are lured there seeking wisdom but after they find it/her they are enlightened and can leave). Proverbs 23 tells you that beating your children with a stick will rescue their souls from hell - useful advice for any parents out there... and Proverbs 27 tells us that hell is never full, so people still want things. This last one fits in with the earlier references in this book to give an almost Buddhist view of Hell. Your soul is in hell when you seek things (material things, wisdom, etc.) but when you can conquer your desires you can escape Hell once more.

6) Later OT books have a few mentions of Hell, but give no real extra information. These references agree with the earlier ones that souls both living and dead reside in Hell, and that they can leave (c.f. Isiah 5, 14, 28, 38 and 57). They also agree about the Hell's physical side - with Ezekiel 27 and 28 saying that the city of Tyrus will be physically cast down into Hell - which is located in the lower parts of the Earth.

7) Finally, Amos 9 says that God will kill many people, even if they hide in Heaven or Hell. This would again imply that Hell is a physical place (and so is Heaven).

In summary, according to the OT, Hell is...

a) A physical place beneath the Earth that you can travel to bodily.
b) A place where your soul can temporarily go both before or after death if you are wicked or if you have unfulfilled desires or you are unhappy.
c) Possible to leave, either be gaining wisdom or with God's help.

Now we get to the NT.

1) The synoptics refer to Hell a few times (although John doesn't). Again, it is somewhere you can go physically (Matthew 5, 11 and 18, Mark 9). Hell is now contains an everlasting and unquenchable fire (although it is not made clear whether the whole of Hell is burning or whether there it contains a fire amonst other features - Rev 20 would imply the latter). Matthew 10 and Luke 12 are similar in spirit (but Matthew goes one higher). Matthew 10 says you should be afraid of someone who can not just kill your body, but can also kill your soul in hell. Luke says you should be afraid of the one who can throw you into Hell after you die. Luke 16 has Jesus tell a parable about someone in Hell being tormented by flame - but since this is a parable it is not necessarily supposed to be factual.

2) Acts 2 has the by now routine thanking of God for bringing the writer's soul out of hell, and James 3 repeats that Hell has fires in it (although as a metaphor this time).

3) 2 Peter 2 tells us that the angels that sinned were cast into Hell by God and bound in chains of darkness.

4) Last but by no means least, Revelation has a lot to say about Hell. It says that the Son of Man holds the keys to the place (Rev 1), that a horde of horse sized locusts will come from there, lead by Abaddon (their king) (Rev 9), that 'the beast' will come from there (Rev 11), that Hell will give up the dead that reside there (Rev 20) and that Hell will be cast into the Lake of Fire (which may or may not be the unquenchable flame that the Synoptics talk about).

Again, a summary:

According to the NT, Hell is:

a) A physical place that contains (but is not entirely composed of) a Lake of Unquenchable Fire.
b) The home for horse sized locusts and Abaddon (their king).
c) Somewhere people's souls can go after they are dead.
d) Going to be destroyed on the Day of Judgement.


Of course, all this contradicts the 'traditional' Christian viewpoint that Hell is a place of eternal torture in flames for the dead that is isolated from God, since...

1) It's not eternal. Hell will be destroyed on the Day of Judgement, and you can get out before then if you are wise or if you have God's help.

2) It is not just for the dead. The Bible is full of people who have been there, both physically and spiritually, whilst still alive.

3) It is not a place of torture. It contains an eternal unquenchable flame that can burn/kill your soul, but it is the flame that is eternal, not the burning. Also the OT makes it clear that people go there because they are unhappy/unfulfilled, not that people are unhappy because they are there.

4) {And this one is slightly off topic} Nowhere does the Bible say that people's souls will be tortured forever unless they worship Jesus/God. It says that those who do will have eternal life (i.e. their souls will live on forever after their body dies - c.f. John 3) and those who don't will die a second death where their souls die after their body has (c.f. Matthew 10, Rev 20)

5) It is not a place in isolation from God. God is in Hell.

Amos

Exactly, but we can be torn between heaven and earth and that must be hell. If heaven is "'hot" and earth is "cold" it must be "lukewarm" to have one leg in heaven and one on earth.

This here is where the physical world caves in around the believer but is not hell. The "sorrows of hell" are an emotion and not a permanent state of being. It is where Jonah felt guilty for the turmoil around him despite the fact that he paid for his fare and is why Joseph decided to return to the state of mind he was at birth and there gave an account of himself.

Job here is talking about Frye's "parody" wherein we must be "beyond surrender" before God can be of any use to us. "Ecstasy" is opposite to this and is vainglory in the eyes of God.

I don't know about your "after death" interpretation because after our first death we cannot be in hell or we would not be suffering, and after our second death it's all over and we are death.

Notice here that Pilate was concerned that Jesus actually died for had he not died "the second imposter would be worse then the first" (he'd be in hell for the rest of life; Mt.27:64c).

It can be said that we are death to our soul until rebirth but that is not equal to hell because a "timely uttering can bring this thought relief" (Intimations of Immortality). So here the "sorrows of hell" are beyond our own making (or we'd never go there) but are caused by the "curse upon the serpent" in our mind.

Hell is when we are called to enter the race and have been made lukewarm -- to use this metaphor. It is therefore in the presence of God but with the great divide in between God and us which is equal to God being very much aware of hell and is why saints are keenly aware of suffering souls in hell.

Until we complete the race we are in hell but if we do complete the race we will rise from hell into heaven from where hell is cleary visible to the victor. If, on the other hand, we do not complete the race we will die in hell and therefore will have spend eternity in hell when we die nonehteless.

Sophia is our Elizabeth who is Wisdom personified. She reigns in the netherworld from where she strikes at the head of the lesser serpent in the conscious world (our personal world) who in turn strikes at the heel of our human identity and 'when the harvest is ready,' so to speak, Sophia quits striking at the head of the lesser serpent and in this fashion creates an "involutional vacuum" in the conscious mind (involutional melancholia) and this we will interpret as the "sorrows of hell" but really is only the "curse of Eve" who must be motivate herself to be our motivator. Ambition is a sign of a vivid Eve (Valeria in "Coriolanus") and a vivid Eve is its turn is contingent on a voluminous Sophia (Volumina in "Coriolanus") and this combination must exhaust our wants to impregnate virgin Virgilia (our Mary) who is without want herself (still in position to gaurd our entrance to Eden) and therefore gives birth to the child within. This event takes place between Eden and our religious world that we must abandon or there can be no victory (between Rome and Corioli in Coriolanus and never in a church or when enticed by religion). Judas must he hung to fade away as a means to the end.

This "unwantonness" is when hell is full and is the treshold of renewal between Eden and our world. This sentiment indicates that the "harvest is ready."

Beating with a stick is a metaphor.

You can't conquer desires but they must be exhausted because "flesh cannot purify flesh." Our return to Eden is "beyond theology" since theology was why we were banned from Eden. [quote][b]

6) Later OT books have a few mentions of Hell, but give no real extra information. These references agree with the earlier ones that souls both living and dead reside in Hell, and that they can leave (c.f. Isiah 5, 14, 28, 38 and 57). They also agree about the Hell's physical side - with Ezekiel 27 and 28 saying that the city of Tyrus will be physically cast down into Hell - which is located in the lower parts of the Earth. [quote][b]

The city of Tyrus is probably our collected consciousness that must be rescued from hell where it is purified into richess in heaven. If this, then Purgatory is equal to hell for the duration we spend there but not until we die.

Of course, if heaven is a state of mind so must hell be and if heaven ends with our second death so must hell.

Parables not factual???

Rev.20 is about the second death when it's all over. Only the death who were still cold will die the second death and those who live in hell (the netherworld) will be hurled into this pool of fire (will have spend their thousand year reign in the netherworld when they die). The second death will have no hold on the living and will have reigned in the Thousand Year Reign until they die.
The Thousand Year Reign is a metaphor for our intimate knowledge of God.

Matthew is telling us that we should be careful not to be led into an intimate relationship with God if we can't complete the race (try telling Billy Graham this).
An interesting conclusion can be drawn here that those who worship Jesus are in hell. They are ones who have knowledge of God which makes them lukewarm but can't seem to work out their own salvation. They are the second beast of Revelation 13 and not at all like the first that only spend a short time in the hell . . . which is not really hell if it was the place where our "flesh" is purified before it can be redeemed in heaven.

You may wish to adopt a different interpretation for the word eternal. Eternal means without time or in the absence of time. It does extent over time but beyond our acute awareness of time.

Magus55

Hell is not the same place as the lake of Fire Pervy. We just use Hell synonymously (sp) with it, because thats the most commonly used term.

Rev 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

The Hebrew word for Hell used in the Gospels is Gehenna, which was a valley near Jerusalem where the dead and animals were burned. Maybe Jesus used that word because the people he taught it to could relate to the pit of burning dead near their city.

Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Sounds eternal to me. And who really cares whether Hell is eternal or not. Its not a place i'd ever want to be, when you can have eternal life with God instead.

Yahzi

Thank you, Pervy, that was very enlighting!

I'm interested in hearing more about this idea that one's existance in Hell is not eternal. If God destroys the place and its population just ceases to exist, wouldn't that be a strong defense against our charges of God's injustice? And if there is no Biblical reason not to use that defense, why aren't the apologists using it?

mike_decock

Some are.

http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/tbhell.html

-Mike...

judge

Sheol in the OT is usualy taken to mean the grave or perhaps the place of the dead.

This should not be confused with the aramaic word g'henna for the valley oiut side jerusalem.
This word does appear in th OT but only in the Aramaic targum of Isaiah chapt 66..."where the worm dieth not"

Thus it seesm that Jesus when he talks of g'henna where the worm dieth not" He is referring to the Aramaic targum of Isaiah.

Here g'henna seesm to refer to the place of judgement and destruction at the end of the age when the new era/covenant is ushered in.

Paul in the Aramaic versions of his letters does refer to the "house of the dead", but this Aramaic phrase is not literally translated into the greek translations

judge

An interesting way to look at this is to lok at what the hebrew or aramaic phase which we translate as eternal actually meant to them.

I don't think if we look at the way it is used we could say it means neverending (at times it may though).
In aramaic it seems to be an idiomatic construction which literally reads "to the world/age"

I have heard it suggested it can mean "a long time"..."an indeterminate time" etc...etc...

EGGO

I would suggest looking for the book of Peter.

Yah I know Christians banned it from the Bible, but it has a pretty different explanation of it.

Sensei Meela

Quick thought...

Metaphorically, "fire" is symbolic of destruction, not torture (save a spot here or there). Thus, a sinner who is subject to "everlasting fire" is subject to everlasting destruction, ie non-existence. Such a state of non-existence, with no hope of existing again, ever, is an everlasting punishment.

Which is essentially how Jews (some) ("of old") see it, 'Hell' being an eternal grave. Or so I gather.

Does that hold up to scrutiny though?

SkepticBoyLee

God annihilating peoples existances is still cruel and unjust. Not the Hitlers and the child rapists mind you....but the "regular" people who were of other religions or werent convinced that christianity was all it was cracked up to be. Wiping people from existance is still cruel if you ask me.

Well, supposedly after the end times and the Armegeddon, right before the Judgment mumbo jumbo we are all given new immortal bodys. Then we are judged. "The bad apples" are thrown in hell and tortured by the hellfire flames forever. These new bodys are immortal. But apparently they can still feel pain.