Ljoilae

I think a lot of different people came up with their own Jesus (Jesii?) and they ended up getting fused together. Some people had Jesuses that were about doing what was right (the good Samaritan Jesus), some people had Jesuses that were legalistic (you have to do this and that), some people had a Jesus that was the Prince of Peace, others had the Jesus that brought the sword, some people had an ascetic Jesus, and others didn't.

Jeffrey Gibson

So the answer is NO.

You think? In other words, you don't know?

Irrelevant. And it was hardly remote to the people of the culture in which Gautama lived.

It does? In Buddhist thought? And what figure are we taking about now?

Again, documentation, please.

Jeffrey

mountainman

Hello Jeffrey,

Contrary to common sense the activity
of, for example, the Pythagorean vow of
silence, is an experiential and ascetic
activity, involving a certain amount of
self discipline and zero documentation.

Have you ever tried that?

More importantly did Jesus Christ, the Son
of the Living God of the Observable Universe
(within the Hubble Limit), keep silence in
the footsteps of Pythagoras, whose theorem
still graces our understanding of physical
relativities?

Did Eusebius mention he kept his mouth shut?


Best wishes,


Pete Brown

Amaleq13

Zero documentation? What are you talking about? If there was no documentation of the vow, you would not know it existed.

Jesus isn't silent in any of the Gospels except when he refuses to answer some of the questions put to him. In John, he is rather excessively verbal.

Once again, there appears to be a significant lack of connection between your imaginings and the actual text. :huh:

And why do you choose to format your posts as though they were poems?

Chidori

The fat, jolly Buddha is not a depiction of Siddhartha Gautama, for those who might not be aware.

http://www.smiling-buddhas.com/
http://www.smiling-buddhas.com/history.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budai
http://www.newsfinder.org/site/more/...ughing_buddha/
http://www.buddhist-artwork.com/budd...tue-japan.html
http://www.amuletjewel.com/index.php?tpid=0048

mountainman

Sounds like a patchwork quilt doesn't it?

Yet the ascetic thread appears to have been
woven into it for a good reason. The Ency.
Britannica reports that Zulus did not trust a
medicine man who was not thin from ascetism.

What link exists in the ancient world between
asceticism and healing?


Best wishes,


Pete Brown

Ray Moscow

I think the "forty days" is one tradition of the time the soon-to-be Buddha sat before he finally achieved enlightenment. For example, it's mentioned here but without reference to whatever "scripture" or tradition this might come from.

Some sources, like this one, put it at 49 days. There is also a tradition of just him just comtemplating things for 49 days after Enlightment, so this could easily get confused.


The number forty also came up in his 40 subjects of meditation

If anyone finds primary references to the 40 days, please post them.

mountainman

Notably, Jesus is not reported to have undertaken a
five year vow of silence, as were some. This was my
point.

Because there
is not yet
a law against it.

Best wishes


Pete Brown

Jeffrey Gibson

To my knowledge, there are none. And there are certainly none that say that Gautama's austerities -- the ascetic practices he engaged in between his Great Departure and his realization that there must be a middle way -- lasted for forty days.

Jeffrey

Jeffrey Gibson

What ascetic thread? You've still not shown that there is one, especially if by asceticism you mean a consciously undertaken practice of denying oneself food and drink or carnal pleasures as an expression of world rejection or adherence to a moral code and/or to attain a "higher" state of consciousness.

Great. But did Jews feel the same way about their healers? And what has this to do with what it was within a Jewish context that stood behind the practice of fasting? Why did Jews fast and on what occasions?

The question you should be asking -- and answering -- is what link, if any, exists in first century Palestinian Judaism between asceticism and healing. Where is the Jewish evidence that there was an such link? And when in the Gospels is Jesus ever portrayed as having the power to heal because he fasts or denied himself meat or alcohol or goes without sleep, etc.?

Were is there an attribution to John the Baptist of "healer/medicine man"/exorcist?

In any case, when are you going to answer the question of what the motive was behind the Jewish practice of fasting? Was it ever to achieve a higher state of consciouness? Was it ever based in sarcophobia? Was it thought to be an expression of a moral stance, as some forms of vegetarianism is today.

Jeffrey
Jeffrey