Freethought & Rationalism Archive

ApostateAbe · 07-11-2011, 01:49 PM

Resolution: The historical Jesus predicted a first-century doomsday. I take the Pro position, and JonA (J.Maximus) takes the Con position, arguing for uncertainty.

This debate is almost over (27 more hours at most), it is long and rambling, but it is unquestionably educational and interesting. "Doomsday cult leader," the way I see it, is just another way of expressing the model of the historical Jesus that is most commonly believed among secular historians of the New Testament. They say, "apocalyptic prophet," but I prefer plainer language.

hjalti · 07-11-2011, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonA

Mark and Matthew contain the story of Jesus rebuking Peter (Mk 8:27–33; Mt 16:13–23) for focusing on the apocalyptic aspects of his messiahship.

That's a very "creative" interpretation in my opinion.

ApostateAbe · 07-11-2011, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hjalti

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonA

Mark and Matthew contain the story of Jesus rebuking Peter (Mk 8:27–33; Mt 16:13–23) for focusing on the apocalyptic aspects of his messiahship.

That's a very "creative" interpretation in my opinion.

I think so, and that creativity did not escape my notice.

ApostateAbe · 07-11-2011, 05:11 PM

Just so nobody gets the wrong idea, JonA does not "fully believe in the position" that he is defending. Not sure exactly what that means, but it would be at least partially devil's advocate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonA

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

JonA has decided to be my contender, and I think it is already the most sophisticated debate on Debate.org within the last several months.

You are doing good! I must admit that I don't fully believe in the position I'm defending; this will definitely be a challenge for me.

aa5874 · 07-11-2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

Just so nobody gets the wrong idea, JonA does not "fully believe in the position" that he is defending. Not sure exactly what that means, but it would be at least partially devil's advocate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonA

You are doing good! I must admit that I don't fully believe in the position I'm defending; this will definitely be a challenge for me.

Well, this is really strange.

Somehow I think I know the outcome.

Please debate people who "fully believe in the position".

I expect Jona to be extremely weak.

ApostateAbe · 07-11-2011, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

Just so nobody gets the wrong idea, JonA does not "fully believe in the position" that he is defending. Not sure exactly what that means, but it would be at least partially devil's advocate.

Well, this is really strange.

Somehow I think I know the outcome.

Please debate people who "fully believe in the position".

I expect Jona to be extremely weak.

Who do you recommend?

mountainman · 07-11-2011, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

"Doomsday cult leader," the way I see it, is just another way of expressing the model of the historical Jesus that is most commonly believed among secular historians of the New Testament.

It was Doomsday for the Gentiles.

JonA · 07-12-2011, 02:23 AM

Let the voting begin!

You did a fine job, Abe. I think you had some weak points, and so did I. With such few words available, it can be difficult getting out all the things you want to get out.

Overall, your argument was quite strong; I can only hope I presented enough of a worthy challenge to not have wasted your time.

To a fun, amicable, informative debate: *cyber handshake*

Jon

Meatros · 07-12-2011, 11:58 AM

I thought it was great and very informative. I've voted.

Good show!

ApostateAbe · 07-12-2011, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonA

Let the voting begin!

You did a fine job, Abe. I think you had some weak points, and so did I. With such few words available, it can be difficult getting out all the things you want to get out.

Overall, your argument was quite strong; I can only hope I presented enough of a worthy challenge to not have wasted your time.

To a fun, amicable, informative debate: *cyber handshake*

Jon

I agree. *cyber handshake*

07-11-2011, 01:49 PM	#1
ApostateAbe Contributor Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: MT Posts: 10,656	JonA and I debate the historical Jesus on Debate.org Resolution: The historical Jesus predicted a first-century doomsday. I take the Pro position, and JonA (J.Maximus) takes the Con position, arguing for uncertainty. This debate is almost over (27 more hours at most), it is long and rambling, but it is unquestionably educational and interesting. "Doomsday cult leader," the way I see it, is just another way of expressing the model of the historical Jesus that is most commonly believed among secular historians of the New Testament. They say, "apocalyptic prophet," but I prefer plainer language.

07-12-2011, 02:23 AM	#8
JonA Regular Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Minnesota! Posts: 386	Last Round Posted Let the voting begin! You did a fine job, Abe. I think you had some weak points, and so did I. With such few words available, it can be difficult getting out all the things you want to get out. Overall, your argument was quite strong; I can only hope I presented enough of a worthy challenge to not have wasted your time. To a fun, amicable, informative debate: cyber handshake Jon

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07-12-2011, 11:58 AM	#9
Meatros Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Virginia Posts: 944	I thought it was great and very informative. I've voted. Good show!

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