FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > Religion (Closed) > Biblical Criticism & History
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Yesterday at 03:12 PM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-29-2003, 08:06 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Georgia
Posts: 718
Default

As I understand it, Peter and Paul split on this issue until a council in Jerusalem in about 50 CE, when it was decided that Paul would continue his evangelical mission among the Gentiles. The issue was huge; after all, Jesus not only said on several occasions that he had come to enforce the law, but he also told his disciples in the book of Matthew to avoid Gentile lands and the towns of the Samaritans in their preaching. And Matthew's account credits Jesus with alluding to Gentiles as dogs and stating that he has come to save the lost sheep of Israel, not anyone else. Among Paul's listeners were many Gentiles who wanted to convert to the early forms of the Jesus movement, but didn't want to give up pork, shellfish, etc. And the men, of course, didn't want to be circumcised, which I'm told hurts like hell in adulthood. Paul--or followers of Paul--relaxed the rules to allow new converts.

Craig
Craigart14 is offline  
Old 12-30-2003, 12:10 AM   #12
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 3,794
Default

Craigart14:

Quote:
As I understand it, Peter and Paul split on this issue until a council in Jerusalem in about 50 CE, . . .
This is the author of Lk-Acts trying to "Petrify" Paul and "Paulinate" Peter. It is different from Paul's Galatians. Certainly, non-Jewish converts and . . . maybe . . . Hellenized Jews would not follow the dietary practices. I add the "maybe" because one of the "things" of the Pharisees was to promote the various religious codes.

Having written that, that does not mean that following Jewish practices . . . like--Ouch!--circumcision . . . were not an issue between the various groups. I am just exercising [Pedantry.--Ed.] caution about making historical conclusions based on texts that are trying to make a founding "story."

Similarly:

4God:

This is a nice confession of faith, but it may not reflect what actually happened.

Nermal:

Quote:
Yeah, but you can't be homosexual, because that OT law still stands.
Ah . . . but in a JBL paper about two years ago, a scholar noted that the language in Leviticus does not ban homosexuality, only a position--in the Holiday Season, remember it is better to give than receive. . . .

Now will someone please explain if we can wear cotton/polyester blends?

--J.D.
Doctor X is offline  
Old 12-30-2003, 09:46 AM   #13
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,969
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Gawen
I already know. Xtianity has it's double standards, the same as everything else, so it seems. My point was: Jews worshiped for one way for so long and then this upstart comes along and tries to change it?? No wonder they got pissed at him...that is if the stories are true at all.
It would be like Mayans or Aboriginies....one guy comes along and says this is the way and life...etc etc...no more sacrifices cause I'm da man...etc etc...and I'm gonna die for you so you can get to heaven...etc etc. Think they'd crucify him as well? I do.
I'm with ya. I wasn't criticizing your post, but rather the ludicrous attitude taken by modern Christians with regard to the laws of the OT.

Some of them are hanging offenses. Some we just ignore. But there's absolutely no NT gage of which is which.

Ed
nermal is offline  
Old 12-30-2003, 12:15 PM   #14
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Silicon Valley, Calif., USA
Posts: 2,270
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Craigart14
As I understand it, Peter and Paul split on this issue until a council in Jerusalem in about 50 CE, when it was decided that Paul would continue his evangelical mission among the Gentiles. The issue was huge; after all, Jesus not only said on several occasions that he had come to enforce the law,
... said occasions being reported in the Gospels.
... which weren't written until at least 70 CE.
tracer is offline  
Old 01-03-2004, 12:26 AM   #15
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 72
Default

Amaleq:
hmm...how to put this?

Obsolete is the correct term, but you used it incorrectly. Obsolete generally applies to something that was performing a job that has now been replaced by something either more efficient, cost effective, or whatever.

Jesus retort is True as is what I stated. The law is the explainer of good and evil. Jesus, and His Testimony were of a greater law. In this same way, God was instructing Peter on this same issue. So, the law does not pass away, but is made obsolete by the new law.
4God is offline  
Old 01-03-2004, 12:55 AM   #16
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: England
Posts: 5,629
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by 4God


Jesus retort is True as is what I stated. The law is the explainer of good and evil. Jesus, and His Testimony were of a greater law. In this same way, God was instructing Peter on this same issue. So, the law does not pass away, but is made obsolete by the new law.
Sounds like passed away to me.....
Steven Carr is offline  
Old 01-03-2004, 01:50 AM   #17
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Hayward, CA, USA
Posts: 1,675
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Doctor X
Now will someone please explain if we can wear cotton/polyester blends?
[/B]
Or lindsey-wooley, which was one of the most common textiles used in Europe during medieval times. Linen-wool blends were awfully common, even during the roman-ruled period.
Jackalope is offline  
Old 01-03-2004, 03:30 AM   #18
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: midwest usa
Posts: 1,203
Default

I dont care about any gods words I LOVE BACON.
mark9950 is offline  
Old 01-04-2004, 07:03 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: voston
Posts: 699
Default

Quote:
I dont care about any gods words I LOVE BACON.
Yes but, do you profess, to be a "Christian"?
beanpie is offline  
Old 01-05-2004, 09:17 AM   #20
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,858
Default

In the Book of Galatians, and the passage in Acts its explained why Christians eat pork, and the other things that the devout Orthodox Jews do not eat. When the Bible was written the condemnation against eating pork made since sanitationwise. Pigs aren't clean, ovens were outside, being sure it was cooked properly so as to prevent illness was tough, so it made sense to prohibit its consumption. Now with modern sanitation, and cooking facilities there really is no reason to not eat pork unless you are a vegetarian, or someone watching your fat/salt intake. The Hebrew dietary laws made sense at the time, now they don't. That just reasonable beanpie.
Lanakila is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 11:31 AM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.