Joan of Bark

You believe that despite creating floods, hurricanes, earthquakes, malaria, polio, yellow fever, bubonic plague, smallpox and Sudden Infant Death Syndrome, God is not evil??? On the contrary, He is the definition of evil.

Unless, of course, He doesn't exist ...

figuer

Bible-god's only purpose would be self-entertainment. Hell is torture, as there can be no 'use' for eternal punishment of innocent sentience.

Reason

Although we ultimately conclude the babble and related beliefs are bullshit by evaluating available evidence (or, more correctly, lack thereof), but most of us did not/do not get there overnight. It starts with small doubts and questioning the inconsistencies.

The fact that other xtians had "no problem with it" and you did is evidence that you are a better thinker and not a sheep. The "other xtians" were simply better skilled in the art of self-delusion.

Wiploc

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If reprobates try to be good, god "hardens their hearts and darkens their counsels." How then are they responsible for their actions?



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What would "evil" mean in this context? When I use the word, I generally refer to causing unhappiness. But, by flooding the Earth, torturing people forever, god is obviously evil in that sense. In what sense is god not evil?

crc


[quote]

Deus Ex

Any god that...

(a) Creates beings in a flawed state

(b) Condemns those beings for being flawed (which it created flawed)

(c) Sentences those flawed beings to eternal punishment for following their flawed nature

(d) Then only 'saves' a small handful of those beings

... is evil. (as I judge evil with my own subjective morality)

Lógos Sokratikós

Calvinists like to present their ideas as sola scriptura, but there are a number of them which are non-biblical or depending on interpretations, such as predestination. "We are the true church with the true doctrine" is not a claim exclusive to them. Any such claim is necessarily and justifiably controversial. As Figuer said, the bible itself is contradictory, and if so, no coherent pristine original doctrine is obtainable without completely justified controversy.

The perfect word of the perfect God is certainly unobtainable.

Chadley Krakka

Well, a Christian would say that God did not create Adam and Eve flawed, but perfect and yet it was Satan who would made them go astray.

The Christian would say that the human has no excuse in the first place since he/she was sinful from the start (Original Sin).

The Christian would say that it is the humans who chose death, it is not God who chose for them.

But as hard as I try to logically reconcile my above explanation with "humans did not choose to follow God, it is God who chose them", I can't. That is why it gradually turned me Agnostic, and eventually the today Atheistic me.

The Christian would say that human judgment is inferior to God's superior judgment.

Deus Ex

Who allowed Satan to tempt A&E? Who was omniscient and knew the outcome of his creation? Who placed the forbidden fruit in the middle of the garden?
Why do I inherit sin? Who made up the rules? Answer: The God that created me.
No person willingly sends themselves to an eternal hell. Many of us simply don't believe in the supernatural. Is that cause for eternal punishment?


I turned agnostic for many of the same reasons.


Yet Christians judge God to be good using their own inferior judgment.

Chadley Krakka

I'm very sure pastors would tell me that it is all part of a great, elaborate plan by God. The big plan where Jesus would come and save us from all sins by dying on the cross. We have to look at the big picture.

I do think I have the answer for that. The Bible says that it is the fool who says that "there is no god". But in our hearts we "know" what's the truth. Shrug.

God is good because the Bible tells me so.

Lógos Sokratikós

And how do you know the bible is good?