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Old 10-14-2011, 09:32 AM   #111
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I haven't studied them, either. If I were to do so, it would be to form my own judgment as to whether the authorities were justified in their belief that the writings actually contained interpolations. But in order to do that, I would have to become fluent in NT Greek, and I have not had time to do that. Until I can do it, I must suppose that the consensus is justified, if in fact there is such a consensus, and as far as I can tell right now, there indeed is one. The authorities disagree as to the extent of interpolation, but not (except maybe among a few inerrantists) as to whether the extant manuscripts do include some interpolations.....
Once you ADMIT you have not studied the interpolations and ADMIT that you would need to be fluent in NT Greek then your supposition about the interpolations are of little value.

Even if inerrantists believe there are no errors in the NT it must be that they could be right that there are NO interpolations as suggested.

Unless it can be shown that an author could NOT have a written a passage or that the author contradicts himself in an earlier writing, or that an original or some work is found without the supposed interpolation then arguments about "interpolations" are SPECULATIVE and futile.

It is most laughable when people attempt to DISCARD any evidence that DESTROYS their position by claiming the evidence was interpolated.
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Old 10-14-2011, 10:35 AM   #112
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And if that is so, then it is not clear to me why the the mythicist's interpolation argument must be dismissed out of hand on grounds of special pleading.
I don't recall dismissing a mythicist interpolation argument, so am not sure what you are addressing that I had said. I was simply expressing my opinion that the gospels read to me like they were written with the intention of expressing actual historical events in order to make theological statements. At least two of the gospels make the claim of being historical accounts, more or less.

Those that claim the gospels were written as fictional stories and allegories rely on interpolations (rightly or wrongly) to dismiss outright claims of history. I also consider the fact that we not only have no evidence that anyone understood the works (or even just Mark) to be fictional, nor any of the 'many' gospels that also existed (some perhaps before Mark), to be very significant. People were NOT writing about superman for entertainment. I just don't believe that. I think they would have taken ANY writing about the Messiah and Savior of their souls very seriously. Any changes they made would have been to reflect what they BELIEVED was true, and not to write an entertaining or instructional story.

My comment about Paul's epistles is that they read not as fiction but as 'real life' also. I was referring here not to a historical Jesus but to a historical Paul. I really think those who believe the Pauline epistles to have been written much later by someone pretending to be Paul to be off the charts in terms of interpretation ability, and not in a good way. But, as always, that may just be me.
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Old 10-14-2011, 11:13 AM   #113
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...Those that claim the gospels were written as fictional stories and allegories rely on interpolations (rightly or wrongly) to dismiss outright claims of history.....
You claim is blatantly erroneous. It is the complete opposite.

In the NT, it is ACTUALLY found written that Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost.

People who claim OUTRIGHT History MUST DISMISS the actual WRITTEN EVIDENCE of MYTHOLOGY.

You DISMISS Matthew 1.18--Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost

You DISMISS Mark 6.49--Jesus WALKED on the sea.

You DISMISS Mark 9.2---Jesus TRANSFIGURED with the resurrected prophets.

You DISMISS Mark 16.6--Jesus was claimed to have resurrected by a man in WHITE clothes.

You DISMISS actual written evidence of MYTHOLOGY to claim the OUTRIGHT history of YOUR Jesus.

You are NOT doing history just OUTRIGHT DISMISSAL of the evidence of the past that can show that the history of Jesus was Myth.

You can't CONCEAL the evidence of Myth Jesus by DISMISSAL. Those days are over. This is the 21 st century.

HJ can be DISMISSED outright because of ZERO evidence or sources.
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Old 10-14-2011, 11:20 AM   #114
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aa, you are such a broken record that I no longer try to address your responses. They usually, as in this case, have little to do with what I've said.

You have a mantra that is very simple:
The gospels contain fiction. Therefore Jesus never was a historical person and the gospels were not written with a historical intent.

Your mantra is flawed. And, quite annoying.
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Old 10-14-2011, 11:45 AM   #115
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aa, you are such a broken record that I no longer try to address your responses. They usually, as in this case, have little to do with what I've said.

You have a mantra that is very simple:
The gospels contain fiction. Therefore Jesus never was a historical person and the gospels were not written with a historical intent.

Your mantra is flawed. And, quite annoying.
You POST propaganda.

You make claim about the Gospels WITHOUT a single shred of supporting evidence.

Although the NT CLEARLY states Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost, was God and the Creator of heaven and earth which is ACTUAL WRITTEN EVIDENCE OF MYTH, you still want people to believe WITHOUT any supporting evidence that the Jesus story should BE REJECTED and REPLACED with YOUR IMAGINATION.

You IMAGINE Jesus was a man CONTRARY to the very Gospels.

You BELIEVE what you IMAGINE is OUTRIGHT History. That is your MANTRA.

But, my Mantra is the GOOD NEWS. Jesus was FATHERED BY A Ghost, TRANSFIGURED, and was RAISED from the dead on the THIRD day.

That is MY Mantra. That is the Gospel truth. That is the WRITTEN evidence. That is the GOOD NEWS. Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost.

You can't DISMISS the GOOD NEWS, NOW.

You can't DISMISS the TRUTH, Now.
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:07 PM   #116
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So, aa, do you believe the gospels were intended to be bedtime stories for little boys and girls?


Quote:
Originally Posted by aa5874 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TedM View Post
aa, you are such a broken record that I no longer try to address your responses. They usually, as in this case, have little to do with what I've said.

You have a mantra that is very simple:
The gospels contain fiction. Therefore Jesus never was a historical person and the gospels were not written with a historical intent.

Your mantra is flawed. And, quite annoying.
You POST propaganda.

You make claim about the Gospels WITHOUT a single shred of supporting evidence.

Although the NT CLEARLY states Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost, was God and the Creator of heaven and earth which is ACTUAL WRITTEN EVIDENCE OF MYTH, you still want people to believe WITHOUT any supporting evidence that the Jesus story should BE REJECTED and REPLACED with YOUR IMAGINATION.

You IMAGINE Jesus was a man CONTRARY to the very Gospels.

You BELIEVE what you IMAGINE is OUTRIGHT History. That is your MANTRA.

But, my Mantra is the GOOD NEWS. Jesus was FATHERED BY A Ghost, TRANSFIGURED, and was RAISED from the dead on the THIRD day.

That is MY Mantra. That is the Gospel truth. That is the WRITTEN evidence. That is the GOOD NEWS. Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost.

You can't DISMISS the GOOD NEWS, NOW.

You can't DISMISS the TRUTH, Now.
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:58 PM   #117
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So, aa, do you believe the gospels were intended to be bedtime stories for little boys and girls?..
Read the Gospels.

Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost, was God and the Creator of heaven and earth and was RAISED from the dead on the THIRD day. That is the GOOD NEWS.

You CAN'T DISMISS the Gospel truth.

You can't DISMISS the GOOD News.

You can't DISMISS the history of your LORD and SAVIOR, NOW.

Your LORD and Savior was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost .
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Old 10-14-2011, 02:05 PM   #118
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So I'll ask again: aa, do you believe the gospels were intended to be bedtime stories for little boys and girls?..

Quote:
Originally Posted by aa5874 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TedM View Post
So, aa, do you believe the gospels were intended to be bedtime stories for little boys and girls?..
Read the Gospels.

Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost, was God and the Creator of heaven and earth and was RAISED from the dead on the THIRD day. That is the GOOD NEWS.

You CAN'T DISMISS the Gospel truth.

You can't DISMISS the GOOD News.

You can't DISMISS the history of your LORD and SAVIOR, NOW.

Your LORD and Savior was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost .
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Old 10-14-2011, 02:20 PM   #119
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So I'll ask again: aa, do you believe the gospels were intended to be bedtime stories for little boys and girls?....
Now, stop parroting. You appear to have lost focus.
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Old 10-14-2011, 02:41 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TedM View Post
So I'll ask again: aa, do you believe the gospels were intended to be bedtime stories for little boys and girls?....
Now, stop parroting. You appear to have lost focus.
I'm wondering just why you think the writers wrote the gospels. What was their intention, in your opinion? What were they trying to accomplish?
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