Freethought & Rationalism Archive

rainbow walking · 11-15-2004, 06:45 AM

I'm having a discussion on the subject of women ministers and teachers in the church. I realize there are many verses in the NT dealing with this subject and would like some input from those with more biblical knowledge than myself. Personally I see no problem with it but am curious as to how the modern religious perspective has been formed about this subject. Not really seeking a debate but just informed opinions. Any contributions appreciated.

Chris Weimer · 11-15-2004, 06:47 AM

I believe somewhere in Corinthians (gotta catch a class soon! sorry) it is said that women should not speak in churches, but if they wish to find out anything, they need to ask her husband.

rainbow walking · 11-15-2004, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cweb255

I believe somewhere in Corinthians (gotta catch a class soon! sorry) it is said that women should not speak in churches, but if they wish to find out anything, they need to ask her husband.

rw: Hi Cweb,
You are correct. I'm just curious as to how these particular doctrines have evolved or been circumvented to justify/allow modern christianity to practice or permit women to do just that. Any input on this would be appreciated.

Soul Invictus · 11-15-2004, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rainbow walking

I'm having a discussion on the subject of women ministers and teachers in the church. I realize there are many verses in the NT dealing with this subject and would like some input from those with more biblical knowledge than myself. Personally I see no problem with it but am curious as to how the modern religious perspective has been formed about this subject. Not really seeking a debate but just informed opinions. Any contributions appreciated.

Paul yields his views on the patriarchial superiority and his apologetic explanations in 1 Timothy 9-15 I believe there is more; I hope this helps for now.

Lucretius · 11-15-2004, 08:22 AM

Its Corinthians 14 : 34 and 35

"34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."

Soul Invictus · 11-15-2004, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucretius

Its Corinthians 14 : 34 and 35

"34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.
35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."

Thanks Lucretius,

That's what I was looking for, and when I quoted what I did, I knew I was missing something. Thanks again.

rainbow walking · 11-15-2004, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Invictus

Paul yields his views on the patriarchial superiority and his apologetic explanations in 1 Timothy 9-15 I believe there is more; I hope this helps for now.

rw: Okay I'm familiar with the passages that describe the woman's role in the church but what I'm seeking is discussion/opinions on how the modern church justifies this with the modern practice of allowing women pastors, teachers, evangelists, etc. and so forth. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for the scriptural references.

Vinnie · 11-15-2004, 09:27 AM

I had a discussion on relevant info with Metacrock

http://www.after-hourz.net/ri/meta1tim2.html

Jehanne · 11-15-2004, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rainbow walking

I'm having a discussion on the subject of women ministers and teachers in the church. I realize there are many verses in the NT dealing with this subject and would like some input from those with more biblical knowledge than myself. Personally I see no problem with it but am curious as to how the modern religious perspective has been formed about this subject. Not really seeking a debate but just informed opinions. Any contributions appreciated.

“Once upon a time�?, within Catholicism at least, women could not be altar servers, read from the Lectionary (during Mass) or sing in the choir. But, with Vatican II that has all changed. In another 100 years they will be priests. And, prior to Vatican II they had to wear "head coverings" to church, a practice that has almost universally disappeared.

funinspace · 11-15-2004, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rainbow walking

rw: Okay I'm familiar with the passages that describe the woman's role in the church but what I'm seeking is discussion/opinions on how the modern church justifies this with the modern practice of allowing women pastors, teachers, evangelists, etc. and so forth. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for the scriptural references.

Basically the mainstream Protestants have rejected the notion of a literal canon, and sola scripture. Here's a short snipet from the UMC web site:
http://www.umc.org/interior.asp?mid=1086

Quote:

Finally, we can point to a whole host of less prominent statements in Scripture where Methodists, like other Christian groups, have deviated from a literalist reading: Christians must not associate with “a drunkard,�? those who profane the Sabbath should be put to death, the child that curses his/her father should be put to death, etc., etc.

These, and other examples, indicate that God’s people must constantly struggle using the four sources mentioned above to discern God’s will on pertinent issues that present themselves. While the Bible is still our chief instrument in that quest, it is not the only resource at hand. We believe that the Holy Spirit continues to lead, revealing God’s will in ways that previous generations may not have discerned as we face new situations and questions of critical import in our time. On some matters we believe that we understand more clearly God’s will than Christians of previous generations.

Now, more specifically on the question of the ordination of women. Methodists begin by underscoring the point that all baptized Christians are ministers of the gospel. “Our links with the apostolic faith... lead us solemnly to affirm… that all who are baptized into Christ are members of Christ’s ministry....�? (Social Principles, 153) Hence, all of us--men and women--in the Methodist fold are called to witness to Jesus as Lord and Savior. Further, we believe that in the sight of God all--men and women--are equal. “We affirm with Scripture the common humanity of male and female, both having equal worth in the eyes of God.�? (Social Principles, 35) If these affirmations are taken seriously, it is only logical that our Church would conclude that ordained ministry should be open to both men and women--regardless of what some texts of Scripture might suggest to the contrary.

11-15-2004, 06:45 AM	#1
rainbow walking Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Erewhon Posts: 2,608	Woman's role in the church I'm having a discussion on the subject of women ministers and teachers in the church. I realize there are many verses in the NT dealing with this subject and would like some input from those with more biblical knowledge than myself. Personally I see no problem with it but am curious as to how the modern religious perspective has been formed about this subject. Not really seeking a debate but just informed opinions. Any contributions appreciated.

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11-15-2004, 06:47 AM	#2
Chris Weimer Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: none Posts: 9,879	I believe somewhere in Corinthians (gotta catch a class soon! sorry) it is said that women should not speak in churches, but if they wish to find out anything, they need to ask her husband.

11-15-2004, 08:22 AM	#5
Lucretius Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: . Posts: 1,014	Its Corinthians 14 : 34 and 35 "34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. 35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."

11-15-2004, 09:27 AM	#8
Vinnie Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Waterbury, Ct, Usa Posts: 6,523	I had a discussion on relevant info with Metacrock http://www.after-hourz.net/ri/meta1tim2.html

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