aa5874

The following can be found in the Pauline writings, Philippians 2.5-11 But, what year did these things happen?

How did God exalt Jesus?

Who heard or saw God when he supposedly gave Jesus his exalted name?

What did Jesus actually do to get a name above every other name, and that every one in heaven, earth and under the earth should worship him?

Surely before the Fall of the Temple there is no historical source of antiquity that mentioned any Jew called Jesus whose name was above every other name and was so exalted that everything in heaven, earth and under the earth should worship him.

Surely, Philippians 2.5-9 is fiction.

In Josephus, the name Jesus was just an ordinary name given to a madman, robbers and high priest. Not even Simon bar Cocheba, a Jewish Messiah, was given a name above every other name.

If Jesus did exist he could have only been human, and if he died his body would rot. Philippians 2.5-11 would be a LIE.

And if Jesus did not exist, Philippians 2.5-11 would be a LIE.

Philippians 2.5-11 is just a LIE.

John Kesler

Read Robert Price's Jesus Is Dead (or via: amazon.co.uk), starting on page 82, for a discussion of Phil. 2. (Just put "82" in the search window, and select the second result.)

mountainman

God told the head redactor scribe of the NT to give Jesus a coded "sacred" name. It was a hush hush job. Nobody knows when this happened, except that it must have happened early - perhaps before 70 CE - since there is an almost universal use of this in all the earliest manuscripts and papyri. Alternatively, the "head redactor" may have been Eusebius.

Whoever it was that collected the gospels and Paul and the letters of the new testament standardized this coded name in every place, instead of preserving the "full common name".

One possibility --- He got allocated the coded name "ΙΣ" which was previously reserved and allocated to Moses's successor Joshua. This was a great honor. It indicated to the readers of the books of the NT that there was a conspicuous continuation between the LXX and the New Testament and everything was going "according to God's plan". People often referred to the Roman Emperors as "God". Especially when they met them face to face.

mountainman

I just noted the WHEN at the beginning ....

It appears to be an undisputed historical fact that God gave Jesus a name above every other name at the Council of Nicaea in the year 325 CE. God then created a SPECIAL TRUST FUND which was to be administered by the "Christian Church" by which instrument the populace of the Roman Empire was more efficiently able to render unto Caesar the things which were really Caesar's in the first place.

storytime

"put on the mind of Christ", that is to say, that of Caesar. Political intrigue into the then New World Order. Just imagine how long it took for those guys to create "a name above every name" Jewish, and of which they thought to manipulate the Jews into believing one of their own was the new god-man. The Jewish problem solved or what?

storytime

Reasoning would at least suggest that there should have been some form of Jewish record that opposed one of their own as a god-man, an idol for worship. But there is nothing.

Imagine what Fred the Jew was thinking when he first heard the Jesus god-man story. Anyone know any Hebrew curse words? :lol:

storytime

Ya know aa, this story could have been created just for the simple purpose of political bi-partisanship. I mean, Rome certainly didn't need another god or god-in-Caesar typecasting. So why not pacify the Jews by making one of their own a god-man. Still the rough waters, so to speak. :huh:

aa5874

But, if Rome did not need another God why would the Jews need another God?

And in the end was it not Rome who made Jesus their NEW GOD ?

The EVIDENCE seems to indicate that Rome did get a NEW GOD (JESUS) and up to now the Jews still have the same old God.

JESUS PACIFIED THE ROMANS, even the EMPEROR.

storytime

Well, as the Jewish scriptures were used to create Jesus the god-man, there must have been a conspiracy in the works thought to accomplish peace on both sides. And Rome did want to control the Jews "promised land". The first writers then set their plot to bring the one God of Jews into an acceptable form to include Gentiles. The writer, as Paul, pulled whatever he could from Jewish sources, relying on the storyline from days before Abraham where faith alone downplayed the later laws of Moses. Rome thus got itself a new god-man and Jews could maintain their one god Yahweh. Ignorant Gentiles bought it, but knowledgeable Jews who knew their scritpures did not. It was a failed attempt at reconciling Jews into a peace agreement.

How did the first non Jewish writers for Rome's interest keep the story of Jesus crucified a secret from the Jews? The writer, as Paul, gives a clue that Jews had heard nothing of his accusations against them. So what we read in the story is that a man named Paul was running and hiding from Jews who supposedly were out to kill him, but at the same time not any of those same Jews knew anything about Paul's accusations. It seems those same Jews didn't even know about Paul being in Rome having been supposedly rescued from the Jews and awaiting audience with Caesar, in his own hired house.

Have I confused you yet? Not to worry, we can do a lot of speculation on this stranger than strange work of fiction.

aa5874

You have totally confused me.

There is NO NEED to speculate.

You must follow the mythical fiction stories of Jesus, the disciples and Paul just as they were presented.

Just like you would not alter the mythical stories about Achilles, the offspring of a sea-goddess, you CANNOT ALTER the mythical fables about Jesus, the offsping of the Holy Ghost, the Creator with his 12 disciples and Paul.

This is a version of the mythical fable of Jesus using gMatthew with Acts.

ONCE upon a time, Jesus was conceived through the Holy Ghost and a woman named Mary and when he was born the Magi came to visit him after seeing some kind of special star.

An angel told Joseph and Mary to flee to Egypt so that Herod would not kill the baby of the Holy Ghost. When Herod died, Joseph, Mary and the baby Holy Ghost went to live in Nazareth.

Jesus was baptized by John, preached about the kingdom of heaven and that he would be killed and be raised on the third day. He performed miracles and even walked on water.

But, the offspring of the Holy Ghost was crucified because of the Jews and was raised from the dead on the third day.

After the Holy Ghost offspring was ascended through the clouds he sent the Powerful Holy Ghost to his apostles and then they too began to perform miracles and became multi-lingual.

Sometime later, Saul/Paul a persecutor of those who believed in the offspring of the Holy Ghost, was blinded by a bright light and he heard the voice of Holy Ghost man (Jesus) from heaven.

That's all for now on the mythical fables of Holy Ghost man (Jesus), the 12 disciples and Paul.

There is no need to speculate.