Originally Posted by Chili

It means hate and should mean hate but it does not include the word forever to suggest that we should hate them forever.

Notice that it is about "becoming a disciple" and not about becoming a believer or becoming a better believer. To become a disciple we must enter into the reign of God and for this we must have exhausted all our worldly pursuits for happiness and cannot even have one eye asquint towards the world and what it can possibly offer us . . . lest we become enriched by the angel of light instead of God and that is the real urgency of the message here.

'To have reached the end of our world' or the Western end of the world because we were placed East of Eden is a similar metaphor. So are beyond exhaustion, beyond theology and beyond surrender, but is also why Joseph returned to his place of birth where he was beyond theology and there gave an account of himself.

This would exclude our ability to respond to an altar call (Mary led Joseph to Bethlehem) unless we think that the angel of light is sufficient in which case we will have to burn our daily scriptures to keep the flame alive.

Originally Posted by Chili

Except that this verse is not about how we can be a follower but how we can become a follower and to become a follower our very preparations must also be rejected to say that our entire faculty of reason must be left behind to arrive at the right state of preparedness.

Originally Posted by anders

The verse says 'be' in all languages. If "Luke" had intended to stress the 'becoming' part, it would have been perfectly possible to use another verb. Using 'be' (or counterparts in other languages) stresses, as I see it, more the 'staying' aspect than the 'becoming'.

Originally Posted by dmarker

Disciple, according to www.dictionary.com

One who embraces and assists in spreading the teachings of another.
An active adherent, as of a movement or philosophy.

So how long do we hate our families?

Originally Posted by dmarker

Chili,

Why would Jesus require that his followers give up their families?

Would you abandon your child to follow Jesus?

Originally Posted by Magdlyn

In the book, the Incredible Shrinking Son of Man, the author, Robt Price makes a good argument that 2 kinds of disciples are referred to in the gospels: the ascetic wandering preacher types, and the more ordinary, householder, wage earner types. Who have the means to support the poor wanderers.

Both are blessed and legitimate.

Mary called Magdalene and her sister Martha, Salome and other women are written to monetarily support J and his 12. Jos of Arimathea was wealthy enough to offer his tomb for J's burial. Etc.

Does that make sense?

Originally Posted by Chili

Let's hope that bible study is not the same as dictionary study.

The word hate is used here as a hyperbole to show how far into our Advent period we must be before we can enter the reign of God. Let's remember here that Christ was born at midnight, midwinter, midlife, which is supposed to represent the darkest point in our life wherein only we can see the glimmer of hope that was promised to us at Baptism. Accordingly, we must recognize the white candle in our Advent wreath as our very own Baptism candle that will become the star for the magi to follow to and into our own empty lower house (conscious mind).

The above is just a decoration, as you may have guessed, but it does show that we are beyond reason, as you will agree, and therefore beyond the need of those we love to be with.

I'd say at least ten days but for sure until after the magi arrived and wisdom comes our way. Joseph regained his faculty of reason when he returned to the stable (his empty faculty of reason) and began his journey into Galilea. Notice that he was absent when the magi arrived (Mt.2:11).

Originally Posted by Chili

Hi, I answered you before but my computor went down just about then.

Notice that abandonment is not a physical thing but just a mental priority for a certain period of time.

Originally Posted by dmarker

Ah, yes, the interpretation according to context. At least you laid it out for me. Except which other statements are contradictory?