brighid

The other night my mother and I were having a discussion about homosexuality and adultery in the Bible. My mother takes the conservative Christian position that homosexuality is an "abomination" (and therefore they should be denied legal rights) and stated that homosexuality is "mentioned" something like "79" times and adultery is mentioned "far less" and therefore God finds homosexuality to be the "worse" sin.

I was under the impression that the Bible only mentions homosexuality (most specifically in the OT) less than a dozen times, but discusses adultery approximately 50 times (the last time I did a blueletterbible search for the term "adultery" I believe I came up with a number close to this.)

Does anyone have the passages that are perhaps less obvious with regard to homosexuality than those in Deuteronomy and Leviticus about how a man should not lay with a woman?

Thanks,
Brighid

(I hope this is the right forum, I wasn't sure if this or GRD would better suited for my question.)

Vinnie

OT mentions a couple of passages about man lying with a man as with a woman and I think about women lying with women. NT has one verse on homosexuality, possibly two but I think its one. There isn't very much.

The Bible has more comments on "sexual immorality" in general. If you include homosexuality in this category it has more comments.

Also, Jesus was himself gay.

Vinnie

Magus55

And i'm the Prince of England.

brighid

I thought there wasn't much and I was astonished at the "79 times" claim my mother made. I was pretty sure it was no where near this high.

If anyone has the time, or the desire if they could post at least the chapter and verse that would be really helpful. It's a bit easier to research the "adultery" side of things since "homosexuality" is never directly mentioned. I know this subject will come up again and I simply want to be prepared for this conversation the next time it arises.

Thanks,
Brighid

Toto

This is the right forum for all technical Biblical questions. You might find what you are looking for in one of these recent threads:

Homosexuality and the Church (comments on Spong)

Questions about Bible and Homosexuality

Homosexuality, Christianity, and "The Law"

Vinnie

Those stats MUST include avoiding "sexually immorality" in general of which the exegete in question is including teh ghaysechs.

Leviticus 20:13 reads: "If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads."

I Cor 6:9 9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders

Vinnie

Vinnie

Read this paper:

http://www.after-hourz.net/ri/wasjesusgay.html

Then go to this thread and refute it:

http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=84917

I await your detailed evaluation and extensive rebuttal, Prince.

Vinnie

brighid

Thank you Vinnie and Toto. This will all help alot in my future discussions with my mother about homosexuality. Oddly enough, she has never had her marriage to my father annulled and has been living in "sin" for 8 years, albeit with the full privileges of a civil ceremony and the tax and other benefits under this secular law. Her defense is that "spiritually" she and my father were never married (for 23 years) and only a "legalistic" interpretation would disallow her marrying her present husband (yet she argues from a legalistic point of view against homosexuality.)

Brighid

Legion

"Homosexuality" is never directly mentioned (there was no word for it back then). When you see it in passages today, such as the 1 Corinthians passage that Vinnie mentioned, the translator has chosen to translate something to mean homosexuality. Whether or not it actually does is up for serious debate.

Anyway, the alleged references are from what happened at Sodom and Gomorah (Genesis 19), Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13, Romans 1:26-27, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, 1 Timothy 1:9-10, and then even more tenuous than those is Jude 7, 2 Peter 2:6, Deuteronomy 23:17, 1 Kings 14:24, 15:12, 22:47; 2 Kings 23:7 (the Deuteronomy-2 Kings reference being based on some KJV translating that gets an F).

On other side of things, it's been theorized that David (aka, King David) had a homosexual love affair with Jonathan (see 1 Samuel 18:1-4 and 1 Samuel 20:30, for example) and in Matthew 8:5-13 and Luke 7:1-10 it may be that the "servant" the centurion is so concerned about and asking that Jesus heal is a male lover (this theory springs from the use of the word "doulos" for the other servants and "pais," which sometimes means "male lover," for the one).

Al Kafirun

Genesis 19:5 -- story about Sodom and those other cities that Fundies have difficulty pronoucing so they just neglect to mention them. I'm still not convinced the the mob wanted to screw the angels. But if they did how is that an indictment of gayness as opposed to rape? Do angels have schlongs?

Leviticus 18:22 & 20:13 -- direct Laws 'from' God 'to' Moses. But the context is forever lost so who the hell knows. For all intents and purposes it seems to condemn homosexuality.

Romans 1:26-27 -- Very specific reference from Paul that seems only to re-enforce his anti-sexuality in general. And may very well be a lie to libel a rival cult ala Carpocratians.

I Corinthians 6:9 -- reference to the 'effiminate'? Could be spiritually weak...? Who the hell knows. Shame Paul couldn't be more specific.

I Timothy 1:9-10 -- the mystery word translated into homosexual. Again, who the hell knows. Another semantic folly lost to time and translated according to the fashion of the hour.

Then you get into Phelps region. I forget his chapter and verse. I think it was in Amos maybe...? Something about God plucking his favored from the 'brand'. Brand of course being the ancient word for faggot. LOL

But then you have stories about David and Jon fucking and all sorts of perverted shit God eats up with a spoon.