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Old 06-01-2008, 02:05 AM   #1
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Default Established parallels between JtB and Elijah

Has any Christian ever come up with any parallels between John the Baptist and Elijah?

A challenge to Christians. Find some parallels.
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Old 06-01-2008, 03:08 AM   #2
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They both had problems with women who served the king.
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Old 06-01-2008, 05:07 AM   #3
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When the NT links JtB and Elijah I think the primary reference is not to the Elijah in the books of Kings but to the promised Elijah in Malachi chapter 4
Quote:
Behold I will send you Elijah the Prophet before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes...
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Old 06-01-2008, 05:59 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by andrewcriddle View Post
When the NT links JtB and Elijah I think the primary reference is not to the Elijah in the books of Kings but to the promised Elijah in Malachi chapter 4
Quote:
Behold I will send you Elijah the Prophet before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes...
Andrew Criddle
So what are the parallels between JtB and this fictional Elijah?

Does the prescence of leather belts indicate a parallel?
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Old 06-02-2008, 10:51 AM   #5
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So what are the parallels between JtB and this fictional Elijah?

Does the prescence of leather belts indicate a parallel?
My point is that there was an expectation that an Elijah figure would appear as a precursor of the eschatological Day of the Lord.

John was plausibly seen as an important precursor of the Day of the Lord, sent to warn people of its coming, hence............

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Old 06-02-2008, 10:56 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Carr View Post
So what are the parallels between JtB and this fictional Elijah?

Does the prescence of leather belts indicate a parallel?
My point is that there was an expectation that an Elijah figure would appear as a precursor of the eschatological Day of the Lord.

John was plausibly seen as an important precursor of the Day of the Lord, sent to warn people of its coming, hence............

Andrew Criddle
So anybody who walks around with a placard saying 'The end is nigh' is basically Elijah?
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Old 06-02-2008, 12:32 PM   #7
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So anybody who walks around with a placard saying 'The end is nigh' is basically Elijah?
It partly depends on whether one takes him seriously.
(I'm sure JtB's opponents did not regard him as Elijah.)

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Old 06-07-2008, 02:19 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by andrewcriddle View Post
When the NT links JtB and Elijah I think the primary reference is not to the Elijah in the books of Kings but to the promised Elijah in Malachi chapter 4
Quote:
Behold I will send you Elijah the Prophet before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes...
Andrew Criddle
I was just wondering since Elijah in the books of kings went to heaven. Isn't Malachi is refering to the actual Elijah the prophet? I think the gospels are misintrepreting Malachi. He not the sprit of Elijah but Elijah himself is coming on the day of the Lord
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Old 06-07-2008, 05:10 AM   #9
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I think that JtB in the Gospels was certainly patterned on Elijah and meant to represent Elijah.

Quote:
I was just wondering since Elijah in the books of kings went to heaven. Isn't Malachi is refering to the actual Elijah the prophet? I think the gospels are misintrepreting Malachi. He not the sprit of Elijah but Elijah himself is coming on the day of the Lord.
Yeah, but so what? We all know how interpretive this stuff is. Look at all of Paul's serons where he completely misrepresents and misinterprets scripture. A good example from Paul is his discussion of the seed of Abraham or the discussion of the slave woman and the free woman.

A part of these types of religious traditions is the appropriation and reinterpretation of existing themes.

But here are the JtB / Elijah parallels, from (http://www.rationalrevolution.net/ar...ospel_mark.htm):

Quote:
The Proclamation of John the Baptist
Mark 1:
1 The beginning of the good news of Jesus Christ.

2 As it is written in the prophets,
'See, I am sending my messenger ahead of you,
who will prepare your way;
3 the voice of one crying out in the wilderness:
"Prepare the way of the Lord,
make his paths straight"',
Mark 1:2 refers to Malachi 3:1. Malachi is a short book and only contains four chapters. The theme of Malachi is the coming judgment of God on Israel. In Malachi the corruption of the priesthood is discussed and many different grievances are laid out against the Jewish people. The book of Malachi says that the Jewish god will curse the priests of Israel, and the people of Judah are accused of being faithless. Malachi 4:5 concludes by saying, " I will send you the prophet Elijah before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes." In the Gospel of Mark John the Baptist is considered to be Elijah.
Quote:
Mark 1:
4 John the baptizer appeared in the wilderness, proclaiming a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 5 And people from the whole Judean countryside and all the people of Jerusalem were going out to him, and were baptized by him in the river Jordan, confessing their sins. 6 Now John was clothed with camel's hair, with a leather belt around his waist, and he ate locusts and wild honey. 7 He proclaimed, 'The one who is more powerful than I is coming after me; I am not worthy to stoop down and untie the thong of his sandals. 8 I have baptized you with water; but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.'
Mark 1:6 refers to 2 Kings 1:8, which provides a description of Elijah.
NIV

2 Kings 1:
8 They replied, "He was a man with a garment of hair and with a leather belt around his waist."
The king said, "That was Elijah the Tishbite."
This implicit reference identifies John the Baptist as Elijah, but this is not obvious to the reader, for there is nothing in the passage that draws attention to the fact that this line is a paraphrase of 2 Kings 1:8, but nevertheless the identification of John the Baptist as Elijah is of critical importance to the storyline in Mark and comes into play later in the narrative.
Quote:
Death of John the Baptist
Mark 6:
14 King Herod heard of it, for Jesus' name had become known. Some were saying, 'John the baptizer has been raised from the dead; and for this reason these powers are at work in him.' 15 But others said, 'It is Elijah.' And others said, 'It is a prophet, like one of the prophets of old.' 16 But when Herod heard of it, he said, 'John, whom I beheaded, has been raised.'
This again recalls the story of Elijah and Elisha, where Elisha is filled with the spirit of Elijah after he dies.
2 Kings 2:
7 Fifty men of the company of prophets also went, and stood at some distance from them, as they both were standing by the Jordan. 8 Then Elijah took his mantle and rolled it up, and struck the water; the water was parted to the one side and to the other, until the two of them crossed on dry ground.

9 When they had crossed, Elijah said to Elisha, 'Tell me what I may do for you, before I am taken from you.' Elisha said, 'Please let me inherit a double share of your spirit.' 10 He responded, 'You have asked a hard thing; yet, if you see me as I am being taken from you, it will be granted you; if not, it will not.' 11 As they continued walking and talking, a chariot of fire and horses of fire separated the two of them, and Elijah ascended in a whirlwind into heaven. 12 Elisha kept watching and crying out, 'Father, father! The chariots of Israel and its horsemen!' But when he could no longer see him, he grasped his own clothes and tore them in two pieces.

13 He picked up the mantle of Elijah that had fallen from him, and went back and stood on the bank of the Jordan. 14 He took the mantle of Elijah that had fallen from him, and struck the water, saying, 'Where is the Lord, the God of Elijah?' When he had struck the water, the water was parted to the one side and to the other, and Elisha went over.

15 When the company of prophets who were at Jericho saw him at a distance, they declared, 'The spirit of Elijah rests on Elisha.' They came to meet him and bowed to the ground before him.
The clincher:

Quote:
The Coming of Elijah
Mark 9:
9 As they were coming down the mountain, he ordered them to tell no one about what they had seen, until after the Son of Man had risen from the dead. 10 So they kept the matter to themselves, questioning what this rising from the dead could mean. 11 Then they asked him, 'Why do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?' 12 He said to them, 'Elijah is indeed coming first to restore all things. How then is it written about the Son of Man, that he is to go through many sufferings and be treated with contempt? 13 But I tell you that Elijah has come, and they did to him whatever they pleased, as it is written about him.'

It is here that the literary allusion from Mark 1:6 becomes important, because one has to realize from that literary allusion to 2 Kings 1:8 that John the Baptist is Elijah in order for this scene to make sense.
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Old 06-07-2008, 05:57 AM   #10
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My New Bible Commentary Revised comments that the author of Mark actually uses allusions to Exodus as well as Isaiah and Elijah!

Interestingly, on this board we tend to start with Mark and see the other Gospels as subsidiaries, but looking at all the gospels together on issues like this gives a better view of what was going on.

The links between JTB and not sure who in the Hebrew Bible are proudly preached by pentecostals and evangelicals as clear evidence of Jesus fulfilling the prophets!

Methinks JtB is also a literary creation!
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