Freethought & Rationalism Archive

newtype_alpha · 11-30-2004, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inquisitive01

Wow! Wouldn't me-centered speaking, writing, or views seem to define some form of arrogance also?

Good grief....

So a someone who is not "me oriented" would put that how exactly?

Quote:

Honestly, relgion has been done for a certain someone for a long time. Atheism isn't a thing to br preached, in fact one should live their life as separate from religion as practical. But the arrogance of religon touches everyone's life whether they like it or not. It legislates its way into your life. It terrorizes its way into your mindset.

After a while away from religion, someone somewhere must think, even my disdain for it washed away. Some atheists dont care enough to protest it. But religion pushes its way into influence over other people. That reeks of arrogance, wouldn't one other than myself be motivated to build defenses?

Perhaps there is a human being somewhere who lives a life defined by his own principles and who promises to the best of his abilities to not offend your moralities when he interacts with you (minus whatever disdain you may have for his disbelief, and keep in mind it's not about me at all, I assure you!). In turn perhaps we should keep God out of any worldly entity that desires to rule some such person who calls himself an atheist, threaten said atheistic person or otherwise restrict the afforementioned atheists life. Absent that, one must think that a person who defines himself as an athiest would have to restart defending himsself against the arrogance of religion.

By the way, I have no opinion. Dont mind me

Do atheists really waste that much time giving false pretexts of their disposition, or is that mostly Christians--the ones who claim to be humble, non-judgemental and blameless before their angry vengeful volcano god?

rationalOne · 11-30-2004, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inquisitive01

Wow! Wouldn't me-centered speaking, writing, or views seem to define some form of arrogance also?

He's writing about his personal experience (which is pretty much what this thread is about), so of course he's going to use the first person.

Classical · 12-01-2004, 04:22 AM

I meant for my original post to reflect a very honest stance. I did not mean for it to inspire controversy, or result in people insulting each other.

As I read these responses to my initial question, I found a few who seemed to step back and look directly at my question. Thank you for these responses.

Overall, once again, I see much more strength in the arguments and logic of the nonbelievers. Who could reread these posts and not see this? :huh:

Hedshaker · 12-01-2004, 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Classical

Overall, once again, I see much more strength in the arguments and logic of the nonbelievers. Who could reread these posts and not see this? :huh:

Can't remember which thread on here I lifted this from but I thought it read nicely:

Quote:

"What are the facts? Again and again and again - what are the facts?
Shun wishful thinking, ignore divine revelation, forget what 'the stars foretell,' avoid opinion, care not what the neighbors think, never mind the unguessable 'verdict of history' - what are the facts, and to how many decimal places? You pilot always into an unknown future;facts are your only clue. Get the facts!"- Lazarus Long
(Robert Heinlein..."Time Enough for Love")

I an angry Xian takes issue with it then feel free to take it up with Robert Heinlein :huh:

Orbit

Legend · 12-01-2004, 05:42 AM

There is no reality... only perception.

Atheists and theists are as diverse as the variety of life here on earth... there is a general definition, but that is where it ends. All have their own reasons for being as such and all have their own attitudes toward the 'opposition'

Arrogance... a flaw... so what?

Acceptance of what another is may prove to be more rewarding than opposing him in every step and arguing his very being in every turn.

Truth may be indifferent to beliefs, but beliefs are all we have... including the perception that what we know is true. But actually, we are never truly sure that it is...

No matter how sure you are, how does that affect the world?

(Just some random ideas presented in random fashion)

mirage · 12-01-2004, 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legend

Atheists and theists are as diverse as the variety of life here on earth... there is a general definition, but that is where it ends.

Yep. I've seen some of these atheists and they actually had tentacles. :wave: :thumbs: :angel:

Legend · 12-01-2004, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Yep. I've seen some of these atheists and they actually had tentacles.

Since its just typed and I don't know the tone of the statement...
Was that friendly sarcasm or not?

Bill B · 12-01-2004, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IAsimisI

Well yeah, I guess..looking at it now I think I crossed the line a bit and Bill B didn't deserve such a response. So I would like to apologize to him in advance, today has not been a good day.

Apology accepted. I guess I touched a raw nerve with you. Sorry! Clearly, you are as passionate about your worldview as I am about mine, and, OK I'll admit it, the last sentence of my original post (#4 of this thread) could have been somewhat less inflammatory. Unfortunately, I doubt that either of us will ever fully understand the other's thought processes. Experiencing and contemplating this phenomenon called life is obviously different for you than it is for me. I might wish it were otherwise, but the "truth" obviously doesn't care what I think!

Hopeful Monsters · 12-01-2004, 07:47 AM

Interesting to note the passionate exchange in this Thread about exactly who (theist or non-believer) might be being arrogant and egocentric. There is a related Thread in GRD: Is (mono)Theism inherently narcissistic?

fast · 12-01-2004, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Classical

Why would anyone want to be an atheist?

Well, in my case, it wouldn't be for the association to the words negative connotation--that's for sure!.

Despite my social conditioning which ravages my very own desires and opinions, the rational side of me (no matter how lacking it may be) searches for truth (whatever that may be) -- I want to know and not just wonder what is real and what is not.

I too would like to conform to our societies imaginary creatures, but the inherent flaws of contradiction to my perception of reality cannot and will not reconcile, so be it as it may (be it hypocritical that I pretend to conform or be I an outcast for being against), I must forge forward in an unexplained undying thirst to KNOW-and to really know, that is.

12-01-2004, 04:22 AM	#23
Classical Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA Posts: 1,808	evaluating these responses I meant for my original post to reflect a very honest stance. I did not mean for it to inspire controversy, or result in people insulting each other. As I read these responses to my initial question, I found a few who seemed to step back and look directly at my question. Thank you for these responses. Overall, once again, I see much more strength in the arguments and logic of the nonbelievers. Who could reread these posts and not see this? :huh:

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12-01-2004, 05:42 AM	#25
Legend Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Philippines, Quezon City Posts: 417	There is no reality... only perception. Atheists and theists are as diverse as the variety of life here on earth... there is a general definition, but that is where it ends. All have their own reasons for being as such and all have their own attitudes toward the 'opposition' Arrogance... a flaw... so what? Acceptance of what another is may prove to be more rewarding than opposing him in every step and arguing his very being in every turn. Truth may be indifferent to beliefs, but beliefs are all we have... including the perception that what we know is true. But actually, we are never truly sure that it is... No matter how sure you are, how does that affect the world? (Just some random ideas presented in random fashion)

12-01-2004, 07:47 AM	#29
Hopeful Monsters Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: God is a Mind Loop Posts: 1,344	Interesting to note the passionate exchange in this Thread about exactly who (theist or non-believer) might be being arrogant and egocentric. There is a related Thread in GRD: Is (mono)Theism inherently narcissistic?

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