Sheshonq

There is no evidence of misunderstanding or misinterpretation. You know, misinterpretation doesn't exist merely because poor little old you *thinks* it does; you need to prove any claim that I am misinterpreting the text.

Good luck. Since the plain reading of the text here supports my statement -- and not yours -- you are simply in error and acting like a child who cannot admit that fact.

Sheshonq

Yes.

Another misinformed person who doesn't know the military history of these wars.

Sheshonq

No, actually they haven't. They lost the 1973 war, they lost the 1982 war, and they lost last summer's campaign.

C_Mucius_Scaevola

No, they didn't, Matthew did:

Sheshonq

Then why does the NT say otherwise?

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Christ, speaking of his death:

MAT 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Peter, speaking to the Jewish authorities:

ACT 5:29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
ACT 5:30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

Stephen, talking to the Jewish council:

ACT 7:52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers

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The text is pretty clear that someone did kill Christ. And Christ, Peter and Stephen are fingering the Jewish religious leaders and the people of Jerusalem on the act.

Kharakov

Anyone think that a sufficiently advanced civilization will exploit Christian beliefs by carrying out these prophecies and use Christians to take over the world? Sheesh, we are going to get ripped off by aliens...

Furthermore, who here thinks if Jesus was killed, he was killed because of his attempts to set himself up as a high priest of God, above the current establishment? How many of you think Christians would want to kill someone setting themselves above Jesus (of course, to protect the one true religion)?

spin

Neither are you for that matter, if you can't live with this christ-killer stuff. That's one you'd like to disown, despite the fact that it's so embedded in your religion.


spin

Johnny Skeptic

Yes, that is certainly the issue. One of sugarhitman's problems is that no being is good simply because he declares that he is good. If that was a rational approach, then all claims by all beings who claim that they are good would be equally rational.

If God is good, why did he inspire James to write that if a man refuses to give food to hungry people, he is vain, and his faith is dead, and refuse to give food to millions of people who died of starvation? Why would God have inspired James to write that and refuse to give food to millions of people who died slow, painful deaths by starvation?

Sugarhitman falsely presumes that saving people justifies God treating people, including babies, any way that he wants to treat them, and causing animals to kill each other, and people, when innocent animals do not have anything whatsoever to do with the sins that humans commit. Following sugarhitman's same line of reasoning, we should imprison dogs when their owners are sent to prison.

If the God of the Bible does not exist, that easily explains these situations. If a God did insprire the Bible, it is most certainly reasonable for skeptics to want to know more about him before they make their final decisions.

Two things that prevent any decent person from becoming a fundamentalist Christian are that 1) the Bible says that God is merciful, and yet, God endorses unmerficul eternal punishment without parole, and that 2) God refuses to provide some skeptics with evidence that they would accept if they were aware of it.

Regarding mercy, if the God of the Bible exists, if I somehow became the most powerful being in the universe, I would not punish the God of the Bible. I would forgive him, and I would rehabilitate him. Now that is mercy, and yet sugarhitman criticizes me for being a bad old skeptic. Ghandi said that he forgave his enemies, and that the prayed for them. If only the God of the Bible was more like Ghandi was. First Corinthians 13 says that love is patient and kind, and keeps no record of wrongs. That obviously does not include the God of the Bible.

If anything, unmerciful and unecessary eternal vengeance without parole convicts the avenger, not those who he punishes.

All three Abrahamic religions have some of the same roots, and they are all detestible religions that are threats to human societies. No God ever had any interest in animal and human sacrificies. Old Testament Jews copied animals sacrifices from pagans. New Testament writers pirated Judaism and revised it by means of lies and innocent but inaccurate revelations. Later, some Christians wrote interpolations. Based upon the number of known interpolations, it is reasonble to assume that for every obvious interpolation, there are at least ten more interpolations. Possibly no one has said it better than Elaine Pagels did when she basically said that "The victors rewrote history, 'their way.'" By "the victors," Pagels meant Christians who considered themselves to be orthodox Christians. We can only guess how Constantine and Eusebius falsely manipuated the New Testmant Canon according to their own preferences.

Sheshonq

I wondered how long it would take before one of these two guys would pull the "no true Scotsman" fallacy out of their back pocket.

Johnny Skeptic

No they haven't. This all started when Abraham wrongfully stole land from the Canaanites.

The partition of Palestine allowed the Jews to control Jerusalem, and an unfairly disproportionate amount of land based upon land per capita, and yet you claim that the Arabs have always stated the wars. A much more equitable solution would have been joint control of Jerusalem, or dividing Jerusalem in half.

The most important war is the unfair and unnecessary war that God wages not only against skeptics, but also against Jews and Christians. Why would God give Jews parts of Palestine and kill them by various means such as parasites and cancer viruses?

Australia has a very small population, and it is very large. Most of the population lives near the ocean. Now what better place could there have been for God to set up a Jewish nation than in the middle of Australia, with no hatred, and not bloodshed?

The only reason that Jews and Arabs have ever had any problems is because God made sure that they were in the same places at the same times. This is analogous to the detestible, unlawful practice of cockfighting. Cocks would not fight unless humans put them in the same places at the same times.

Why do animals injure and kill each other in disputes over food, territory, and mates? Obviously, because God unfairly and unnecessarily puts them in the same places at the same times.

Now are you going to tell us that if Jewish and Palestinian history had been reversed, and Hitler and other parties had persecuted Palestinians instead of Jews, that the U.S. would have approved of the Palestinians getting control of Jerusalem and a grossly disproportionate amount of land based upon the amount of land per person?