Freethought & Rationalism Archive

excreationist · 03-16-2006, 03:12 PM

Compare the "Laws of Magic":
http://www.themystica.com/mystica/ar..._of_magic.html

Quote:

The second essential law of magic is belief. One must believe in what he does, for without belief there is doubt. To use magical power one has to feel it. This applies to everyone whether one is calling down a deity in a magic circle or praying for a miracle in a church. Doubt leads to failure, belief leads to success, perhaps not always physically, but always spiritually. The above laws just place one in a proper attitude to perform magic.

With:
Mark 11:23-24:

Quote:

"I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in his heart but believes that what he says will happen, it will be done for him. Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

Jesus also refused to do miracles in the presence of die-hard skeptics
Luke 11:29-32
Matt 12:38-42
Matt 16:1-4
Mark 8:11-13

Same when he was with Satan:
Matthew 4:6-7:

Quote:

If you are the Son of God, he said, throw yourself down. For it is written:
'He will command his angels concerning you, and they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'
Jesus answered him, It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'

MadPhatCat · 03-16-2006, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thebeave

Jesus turned water into wine. If that's not a magic trick, I don't know what is.

Damn...I wish I knew how He did that. I'll bet it was the old "switcheroo".

I know we aren't supposed to link to copyrighted stuff, but I am not even sure if they are selling Rowan Atkinson's Concert Hall performance from 15 odd years ago. There is a clip out there where Rowan is a preacher giving a sermon about Jesus turning water into wine. It quickly veers off from official scripture and focuses on further magic tricks. I thought it was funny. Search for "The Amazing Jesus of Nazareth" it should be easy to find...

Edited to add: Hmm, this is what I get for posting in too many forums... I forgot I already mentioned this here.

GodfreyTemple · 03-16-2006, 07:25 PM

Unless it is in fact simply a resurrection of your words and therefore, a miracle.

Helpmabob · 03-17-2006, 03:45 AM

Is there any relation between Religion and Magic?

Yes - Those who are moving in magic circles could concievably call this their religion. Anyone who feverishly follows a god, whether in the form of magic, money or whatever is acting religiously.

GodfreyTemple · 03-17-2006, 09:56 PM

Funny. I feel much the same way about my laundry.

Although my detergent is impressively good.

And here I thought I wasn't a religious person.

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03-16-2006, 07:25 PM	#23
GodfreyTemple Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: In a midwestern snowbank Posts: 510	Unless it is in fact simply a resurrection of your words and therefore, a miracle.

03-17-2006, 03:45 AM	#24
Helpmabob Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: UK Posts: 431	Is there any relation between Religion and Magic? Yes - Those who are moving in magic circles could concievably call this their religion. Anyone who feverishly follows a god, whether in the form of magic, money or whatever is acting religiously.

03-17-2006, 09:56 PM	#25
GodfreyTemple Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: In a midwestern snowbank Posts: 510	Funny. I feel much the same way about my laundry. Although my detergent is impressively good. And here I thought I wasn't a religious person.

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