Johnny Skeptic

My opening statement is directed towards Christians, although skeptics are certainly welcome to make comments.

Apologists assume that God is good, but I do not see any good reasons at all to assume that God is good and that the Devil is evil. Actually, I do not see any good reasons at all to believe that there is a Devil. Why isn’t it plausible that God is planning on sending everyone to hell, and is enjoying deceiving a lot of people into following him by accurately predicting the future and sometimes healing sick people? The Resurrection might have been one of his deceptions. If there can be an evil and deceptive Devil, why can’t there be an evil and deceptive God?

As a side issue, Christians claim that there is sufficient evidence for people to become Christians. For example, William Lane Craig speaks of "multiple, independent attestations." Many Christians put great emphasis on the the 5,000 existing copies of the original manuscripts, the historical accuracy of the Bible, and Biblical archaeology. Is such evidence really all that convincing? Well, it is to lots of people, but ONLY because the Bible promises believers a comfortable eternal life. There should not be any doubts whatsoever that if all of the evidence were EXACTLY the same with the single exception that God is evil and will send everyone to hell, not only would Christians have rejected Christianity, but they would have gone out of there way to disprove it and accept another religion that promised them eternal comfort. No matter what the religion, the lure of eternal comfort will ALWAYS cause believers to defend all kinds of perposterous and outlandish claims. It is interesting to note that the followers of all religions couldn't care less who provides them with eternal comfort as long as it is available. Eternal comfort is definitely to goal. Who provides it is completely irrelevant.

Toto

I don't see much Biblical criticism here. I think this would do better in GRD.

Helpmabob

Initially perhaps. However, once we have been a christian for a while, we learn to trust that God is good, and our experience suggests likewise.The Bible gives some reasons.What might be the point of that? If this is the case, then we are all doomed, and nothing sensible can be said about anything; we might as well all kill ourselves now. If God is evil and deceptive, can anything substantial be said? On the other hand there is purpose to everything when believing that a good God is in charge.

Sven

Umm, how you wish the world to be is not an argument about what actually exists in the world.
So your response to "why god could not be evil" is basically: "Because I don't like this possibility."

Steven Carr

You have to remember the unknown reasons defense.

God allows evil for reasons known only to him, and not to the people suffering.

So Christians admit God is concealing some very important facts from them.

If God is deluding Christians, so he can get all the greater pleasure from seeing them burn in hell, he would very naturally conceal that from them.

Aradia

Your opening statement may be directed towards christians, but you're making gross generalisations about all religious practitioners. Incorrectly, I might add.

Helpmabob

Hi Sven - It’s true that I don’t like the possibility, but I’m not saying that God could not be evil, only that I am reasonably well convinced that He is not. If you count your blessings you will find that you have many good things, which an evil god would want to stop immediately. I was trying to point out the futility of existence under an evil, deceptive God.

Hi Steven Carr - Some things are concealed. Jeremiah and Daniel were both told to keep certain things secret.I can say nothing worthwhile in respect of this concept, except that it does not seem right. If we are all being deluded, then we might as well all pack up and go home. There is clear and obvious distinction between what is good and what is evil. It is a matter of faith that God is good and his word is true.

Johnny Skeptic

[quote=Helpmabob] Hi Sven - It’s true that I don’t like the possibility, but I’m not saying that God could not be evil, only that I am reasonably well convinced that He is not. If you count your blessings you will find that you have many good things, which an evil god would want to stop immediately. I was trying to point out the futility of existence under an evil, deceptive God.
quote]

Why do you as a mere mortal presume to know what an evil God will choose to do? Deceiving people is exactly what an evil God would do. Matthew 24:24says "For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect." If an evil God exists, there wouldn't be any elect.

Which "many good things" are you referring to? It is your position that good things and bad things are not distributed at random according to the laws of physics?

Regarding "the futility of existence under an evil, deceptive God," emotionalism is not a logical basis for making up religions.

Helpmabob

Hi Johnny - OK, we both of us make rather too many presumptions about how a god might act under certain circumstances. For example consider your next assertion:This might be wrong because an evil god has chosen to elect people on some crazy basis. How would we know anything, or make any reasonable judgements about anything? We become like the Philosopher in Ecclesiastes, everything is meaningless. But a good God as revealed in the Bible bring the promise of meaningfulness into one’s life.I was encouraging Sven to count his blessings; mine are such things as food, water, health, fitness, a home, a job, holidays and sport. Even the internet.

DBT

Well the bible God could certainly be called evil.

God deceives some of his prophets and then kills them for believing his lies.

14:9 "And if the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the LORD have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel."