starling

Y'know being a child of Lilith would be really cool. I mean, she was the first woman and all, plus she is the only human being who never indulged in the Original Sin. Many Christians (not all of you, I know) have told me the following argument:

• You have sinned.
• Jesus is the only person who can forgive sins.
• Follow Jesus to make up for all the wrongs you have done.

My protest to this argument is that I haven't sinned. I may have according to the bible, but I don't consider those things necessarily bad, or wrong. Even when I do things that are wrong, I pay the consequences and then it's done. My immortal soul or whatever has yet to be scarred permanently by something I did, that I require the hand up from a godling to make amends from.

To which they respond, "Every human has sinned." When I am persistent in my notion that I have not, they say "Adam and Eve did the Original Sin, which makes all their descendents sinners too." And I usually can't argue much to that, only marvel at their irrationality.

But no longer! Next time a fundie says, "Jesus died for our sins," I'll answer, "Not mine. I can't sin!" and if they ask why, well it's because I'm a descendant of Lilith (and some schmoe). My lineage predates sin entirely!

Reasons it makes sense to be a child of Lilith:

• I enjoy unusual sexual positions.
• I have a very strange sexuality in general.
• I don't feel any burden of sin, or ancestral guilt
• Being part demon would be cool.
• Lilith is a woman equal to Adam, not subordinate to him.
• Adam and Eve's lineage is probably middle eastern (and I'm not)

Toto

Interesting theory, but not related to Biblical criticism. I think this fits in better in GRD.

Boomeister

One problem with this argument is that God wouldn't have saved the descendents of Lilith from the flood. Those sexual perverts! All descendents from Noah et. al are from Adam and Eve...but then again, maybe they were descendents from Lilith. After all, didn't Noah's son have sexual feelings for his drunk father right after getting off the boat? Maybe God made a mistake and saved the wrong people. Bwahahaha!!!

Boomeister

starling

Eh? Biblical history was what I was thinking. Lilith and Adam is a story in the (Hebrew) bible I've heard.

starling

Heh... except for the evil giants that survived the flood. Lilith's children sat on their shoulders while the flood passed, obviously!

And the ducks! Evil ducks!

OdysseusTheInnkeeper

Dear Starling,
Could you please expound more on items 1,2, and 4 in your last bulleted list. I'm not too clear on the specifics. Also you should see the Randian take on the Original Sin Caper posted in the atheist quotations thread. Damn does she know how to carpet bomb biblical jibberish! As far as being equal to adam, Lilith has it wrong. In more ways than not women are actually superior to men, they just require a sane society to recognize this. Which I already do.
sincerest regards, OTIK

starling

Oh dear, tryin' to squick me huh.
1) See here (Note -- just to confirm, this link ain't work safe. )
2) Just for one example, I far prefer helping other pairs of people achieve the above creative positions aside from myself.
4) From what little I could find (haven't read the actual apocryphal story about Lilith), it seems that Lilith abandoned Adam when he tried to make her submit to him from below during sex, and left Eden of her own will defying God and having many carnal relations with demons (fallen angels?).

Could you um... quote her? There is more than one such thread, and the one marked "Atheist Quotes" doesn't seem to have the word 'Randian' in it anywhere.

First off, it was God who would be wrong in saying "I created man [Adam] and woman [Lilith] the same." (He didn't say that of course; the human who wrote the bible claimed it was so.) I find accepting the notion that women are superior to men is more of a reactionary impulse than anything to our mysogynist culture. When it all boils down, our biology is exquisitely tuned for our social nature, and both men, and women play important roles in it. A man can never bear a child, but this does not decrease his worth, merely moves it to other virtues.