Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Julio · 06-07-2009, 10:18 PM

How could such a small cult survive the religious and political turmoil of the first century?
Does the First Council of Jerusalem against circumcision have anything important to do with it? Acts 15.
Or was it the "third" form of baptism, this time revised again by Peter?
First form: Jesus, in Matthew 28:20 (trinitarian formula);
Second by Peter [weeks later] in Acts 2:38 (no trinitarian formula);
Third by Peter in Acts 15:11 (this time no baptism needed to be saved).

ApostateAbe · 06-08-2009, 11:16 AM

Can you explain specifically what would prevent such a cult from surviving? I tend to think that a combination of things caused Christianity to survive and grow, mainly the afterlife doctrines of heaven and hell, but also the scripturalism, the emphasis on evangelism, then emphasis on unity and love, and the monotheism. You need to think about what would be important to a normal human being.

Julio · 06-08-2009, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

Can you explain specifically what would prevent such a cult from surviving? I tend to think that a combination of things caused Christianity to survive and grow, mainly the afterlife doctrines of heaven and hell, but also the scripturalism, the emphasis on evangelism, then emphasis on unity and love, and the monotheism. You need to think about what would be important to a normal human being.

Agree with that. Though I think that removing circumcision from the cult's rules [doctrines] was a great strategic vision.
No cult would survive for so long if the adherents had to get hurt to be accepted [I mean ADULTS being cut!]. And then it would be a cult made mainly of men. Am I wrong?

ApostateAbe · 06-08-2009, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julio

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

Can you explain specifically what would prevent such a cult from surviving? I tend to think that a combination of things caused Christianity to survive and grow, mainly the afterlife doctrines of heaven and hell, but also the scripturalism, the emphasis on evangelism, then emphasis on unity and love, and the monotheism. You need to think about what would be important to a normal human being.

Agree with that. Though I think that removing circumcision from the cult's rules [doctrines] was a great strategic vision.
No cult would survive for so long if the adherents had to get hurt to be accepted [I mean ADULTS being cut!]. And then it would be a cult made mainly of men. Am I wrong?

Absolutely, that rule needed to go. But, if you are trying to find the answers to how the cult of Christianity excelled over other cults, you will sort of need to look broader than that, because circumcision was a special requirement of Judaism, and the circumcision thing would be a problem for only the cults that spring out of Judaism. Other cults would have a head start, because they didn't have circumcision.

Julio · 06-08-2009, 11:01 PM

OK. But what else really important made Jesus' cult survive for so long?

Toto · 06-09-2009, 12:23 AM

I don't think that the cult did survive. It evolved, but later Christian groups bear little resemblance to the earliest Christian group.

dog-on · 06-09-2009, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julio

How could such a small cult survive the religious and political turmoil of the first century?

By being a second century cult...

Solo · 06-09-2009, 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

I don't think that the cult did survive. It evolved, but later Christian groups bear little resemblance to the earliest Christian group.

Who was the earliest Christian group ? Who was their leader ? What did they believe ?

Jiri

Doug Shaver · 06-09-2009, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julio

How could such a small cult survive the religious and political turmoil of the first century?

I don't think it did. I think the only thing Christianity as we know it has in common with first-century Christianity is that they both refer to the object of their worship by the name "Jesus Christ."

spamandham · 06-09-2009, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julio

How could such a small cult survive the religious and political turmoil of the first century?

Since we have no real history of such a cult, I think it's fair to say it didn't survive. What we have today seems to be the offspring of a 2nd century consolidation of cults.

06-07-2009, 10:18 PM	#1
Julio Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Johannesburg Posts: 5,187	Why did Jesus of Nazareth survive? How could such a small cult survive the religious and political turmoil of the first century? Does the First Council of Jerusalem against circumcision have anything important to do with it? Acts 15. Or was it the "third" form of baptism, this time revised again by Peter? First form: Jesus, in Matthew 28:20 (trinitarian formula); Second by Peter [weeks later] in Acts 2:38 (no trinitarian formula); Third by Peter in Acts 15:11 (this time no baptism needed to be saved).

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06-08-2009, 11:16 AM	#2
ApostateAbe Contributor Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: MT Posts: 10,656	Can you explain specifically what would prevent such a cult from surviving? I tend to think that a combination of things caused Christianity to survive and grow, mainly the afterlife doctrines of heaven and hell, but also the scripturalism, the emphasis on evangelism, then emphasis on unity and love, and the monotheism. You need to think about what would be important to a normal human being.

06-08-2009, 11:01 PM	#5
Julio Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Johannesburg Posts: 5,187	OK. But what else really important made Jesus' cult survive for so long?

06-09-2009, 12:23 AM	#6
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	I don't think that the cult did survive. It evolved, but later Christian groups bear little resemblance to the earliest Christian group.

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