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Old 07-25-2008, 03:17 PM   #161
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The world is up to its neck in sin , so much so that some find it hard to see what is true any more amidst the lies... but that is the way scripture says it will be, and here it is , right on cue ...
So,
you are happy to preach from a NT which contains lies by sinners?


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Old 07-25-2008, 03:19 PM   #162
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6.5 billion sinners today is a LOT more sin than the ancient world could muster, even with all its barbarism ...
Well if you're simply talking about pure numbers, then sure. I would have thought you were referring to 'sins per person' or something similar, in which case the ancient world was certainly no holier.

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That rather contorted private interpretation is untrue because the scripture describes signs which have still not been met , let alone in ancient times as you strangely assert.
Of course, I don't know what signs you're referring to.

By the way, it's hardly a private contorted interpretation. It's pretty much the accepted position among scholars.
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Old 07-25-2008, 06:20 PM   #163
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The world has always been "up to its neck in sin" so that isn't much of a prediction.
Yeah but now there are 6'5 billion sinners and only one in a million knows how good life is to be a saint ... the world won the propaganda war of convincing folks to be sinners, now we shall see it fall apart because sin just doesn't make a sustainable world ...
The world is without sin because the world is not Israel. And "sin" was defined by Israeli laws. Why then do you want to accuse innocent people of transgressions[sins]? Maybe the devil is making you do it?
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Old 07-25-2008, 06:40 PM   #164
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Ohmi

You said, "Jesus accepted the scriptures [OT, in effect], not Judaism...and criticized Judaism extensively, as recorded in the NT."

Jesus criticized the doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Jesus referenced the saying of Isaiah - "ye teach for doctrine the commandments of men". Then Jesus called the Pharisees children of the devil. Liars. The arguments of Jesus and the Pharisees, Sadducees were Jewish arguments. Jesus is not shown as arguing with Gentiles about doctrine or commandments. Why? Because Gentiles had no doctrines or commandments.

You said: "There is nothing wrong with the old covenant except that very few could keep it."

The Old Covenant was circumcision and ALL Israelites/Jews kept it in their flesh - their kindred tribes. Although a few people of Israel are mentioned as leaving the God of Israel to go and worship the Queen of Heaven. Seems the Queen of Heaven gave them more prosperity and a better lifestyle than Yahweh, for they said that they were worse off when worshipping Yahweh. So they left Israel and Yahweh and were never heard from again.

Also, there were more than a few Israelites/Jews who traded Yahweh in for the god of Babylon. These remained in Babylon because life was better. More food, better jobs and education, no circumcision.

Yahweh was a tyrant and a mean bloodthirsty god. He hated everyone not Jewish and hated those Jews not willing to kill and slaughter for him. And he loved the aroma of beef roasting. Ever wonder what the Jews did with all that beef after the sacrificing?
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Old 07-26-2008, 01:38 AM   #165
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Originally Posted by ohmi View Post
The world is up to its neck in sin , so much so that some find it hard to see what is true any more amidst the lies... but that is the way scripture says it will be, and here it is , right on cue ...
So,
you are happy to preach from a NT which contains lies by sinners?


Iasion
I ain't preaching ... just discussing ...
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Old 07-26-2008, 02:00 AM   #166
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Ohmi

You said, "Jesus accepted the scriptures [OT, in effect], not Judaism...and criticized Judaism extensively, as recorded in the NT."

Jesus criticized the doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Jesus referenced the saying of Isaiah - "ye teach for doctrine the commandments of men". Then Jesus called the Pharisees children of the devil. Liars. The arguments of Jesus and the Pharisees, Sadducees were Jewish arguments.
So that shows Judaism was corrupt by the time of Jesus and that Jesus did not follow Judaism.

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Jesus is not shown as arguing with Gentiles about doctrine or commandments. Why? Because Gentiles had no doctrines or commandments.
The gentiles have their own gods and the House of Israel worshiped, and still worships, them excepting only the remnant few saints being redeemed through their new covenant.

You said: "There is nothing wrong with the old covenant except that very few could keep it."

Quote:
The Old Covenant was circumcision and ALL Israelites/Jews kept it in their flesh - their kindred tribes.
Not all Israelites did keep the old covenant, indeed very few have done so, so few indeed that God brought in the new covenant with Israel else He would not have enough for His perfect priesthood to later serve the gentiles as priests and kings

Quote:
Although a few people of Israel are mentioned as leaving the God of Israel to go and worship the Queen of Heaven. Seems the Queen of Heaven gave them more prosperity and a better lifestyle than Yahweh, for they said that they were worse off when worshipping Yahweh. So they left Israel and Yahweh and were never heard from again.
Jesus was sent, and sent his disciples, to find the House of Israel amongst the gentiles where they worship other gods ... they are NOT Jews and they do NOT keep Judaism ... so the House of Israel, although not a people, are still a nation in God's eyes, and as descendants of Jacob they receive the new covenant of unconditional unmerited forgiveness...

Thus it matters not that they were never heard of, because God will bring them out of all nations :-

Amos 9:9 For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth.

Isaiah 66:20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the LORD, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD.

Quote:
Also, there were more than a few Israelites/Jews who traded Yahweh in for the god of Babylon. These remained in Babylon because life was better. More food, better jobs and education, no circumcision.
It matters not since the new covenant is unconditional ...

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Yahweh was a tyrant and a mean bloodthirsty god. He hated everyone not Jewish and hated those Jews not willing to kill and slaughter for him. And he loved the aroma of beef roasting. Ever wonder what the Jews did with all that beef after the sacrificing?
The roast sacrifices were eaten by the Levites , as the law states.

Death is of no great consequence to God since He will resurrect all flesh, only humans make a great deal out of death ...

Theocracy is like a benevolent dictatorship, not a tyranny ...
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Old 07-26-2008, 07:30 PM   #167
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Ohmi

You said, "Jesus accepted the scriptures [OT, in effect], not Judaism...and criticized Judaism extensively, as recorded in the NT."

Jesus criticized the doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Jesus referenced the saying of Isaiah - "ye teach for doctrine the commandments of men". Then Jesus called the Pharisees children of the devil. Liars. The arguments of Jesus and the Pharisees, Sadducees were Jewish arguments.
So that shows Judaism was corrupt by the time of Jesus and that Jesus did not follow Judaism.



The gentiles have their own gods and the House of Israel worshiped, and still worships, them excepting only the remnant few saints being redeemed through their new covenant.

You said: "There is nothing wrong with the old covenant except that very few could keep it."



Not all Israelites did keep the old covenant, indeed very few have done so, so few indeed that God brought in the new covenant with Israel else He would not have enough for His perfect priesthood to later serve the gentiles as priests and kings



Jesus was sent, and sent his disciples, to find the House of Israel amongst the gentiles where they worship other gods ... they are NOT Jews and they do NOT keep Judaism ... so the House of Israel, although not a people, are still a nation in God's eyes, and as descendants of Jacob they receive the new covenant of unconditional unmerited forgiveness...

Thus it matters not that they were never heard of, because God will bring them out of all nations :-

Amos 9:9 For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth.

Isaiah 66:20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the LORD, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD.



It matters not since the new covenant is unconditional ...

Quote:
Yahweh was a tyrant and a mean bloodthirsty god. He hated everyone not Jewish and hated those Jews not willing to kill and slaughter for him. And he loved the aroma of beef roasting. Ever wonder what the Jews did with all that beef after the sacrificing?
The roast sacrifices were eaten by the Levites , as the law states.

Death is of no great consequence to God since He will resurrect all flesh, only humans make a great deal out of death ...

Theocracy is like a benevolent dictatorship, not a tyranny ...

The old covenant was circumcision. All Israel kept the old covenant.

New Covenant was law given at Sinai.

You're saying that the 10 northern tribes were Israel. What then of the Jews?
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Old 07-26-2008, 09:58 PM   #168
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So,
you are happy to preach from a NT which contains lies by sinners?
Iasion
I ain't preaching ... just discussing ...
So you accept the NT contains lies by sinners?


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