Wallener

HJ's "the" messiahship candidacy was toast the moment he got nailed to the tree, what stories came afterwards were completely irrelevant from the Jewish perspective. All the nice touches of the robe and the crown and the etc etc etc had to added for a non-Jewish audience, because they would be singularly unimpressive to Jews waiting for a liberator. From a Jewish perspective, none of the story(s) makes any sense from the moment of arrest onwards...

Contrary to the beliefs of many Christians, Jews have not had a problem accepting Messiah. They have done so numerous times. The problem is the standard is pretty unambiguous, and once its clear it isn't being met, whoosh, onto the trash heap.

baloria

If you are not afraid to read what that event stands for and all that fiction in the
Bible,do yourself a favor and buy the best book on this subject(s):
http://www.truthbeknown.com/christ2.htm
Baloria

Julian

If the stone was really so damn heavy I would like to have the following verse from GMt explained to me:

27:60 And laid it in his own new tomb, which he had hewn out in the rock: and he rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre, and departed.

Man, that Joseph must have been one muscular guy...

Julian

Chili

It took him 40 years to carve that tomb in his own mind and I don't think anybody can chance his mind at this time. It just means that he knew what he was doing and where he was going and did not flip-flop between bible passages and salvation messages. . . . but don't call him a liar because if we are ark builders as believers we better be tomb hewers as doubters.

Peter Kirby

Or maybe he just had a really big lever. :Cheeky:

best,
Peter Kirby

Wallener

Nah, too Hellenistic.

Chili

I should have added here that we cannot take our ego along to heaven and therefore must have a tomb ready to put it to rest.

To have faith for 40 years is equal to having doubt for 40 years so the two go hand in hand . . . for when find dry land is found on the other side of life there better be a tomb ready for our ego.

Just go to John where, conveniently, Nicodemus comes along to help Joseph retrieve the body that they buried together in a new unused tomb that Joseph happens to have very nearby in his own garden.

Isn't it obvious that Nicodemus caused the dream in Joseph's mind that he must be born again and here returns to finish the job?

baloria

The resurrection story-fairy tales as told by the "eye-witnesses",Apostles:all different
stories of what is supposed to have happened to the savior-god:
But here I will cover the most important reasons why I don't buy the resurrection story:http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...n/lecture.html
Baloria

John Kesler

Also see this quote from Mark:

How likely is it that the women would go to the tomb without taking anyone with them to roll away the stone, especially if they knew that 16-20 people were required?

John A. Broussard

Let me anticipate the theist response.

The very fact that the accounts differ from each other so much is what proves their authenticity. If they were all the same, then we'd know it was simply a well-rehearsed, fictional story.

Try fighting that!!