Johnny Skeptic

Message to hatsoff: Consider the following scriptures from the NIV:

1 Peter 1:6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you may have had to suffer grief in all kinds of trials.

7 These have come so that your faith - of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire - may be proved genuine and may result in praise, glory and honor when Jesus Christ is revealed.

Regarding verse 7, in his ‘Believer’s Bible Commentary,’ William MacDonald says “There is further comfort for suffering saints in knowing that their sufferings are neither purposeless nor fruitless. The sufferings of the ungodly are only a foretaste of the pangs of hell which they will endure eternally. This is not true for the Christian. On of the many beneficial purposes of afflictions in this life for the child of God is to test the genuineness of his faith. Peter contrasts our faith with gold. Of all the substances known to man, gold is one of the most imperishable. It can be subjected to intense heat and might seem to be indestructible. But the truth is that gold perishes through use, pressure, and fire.

“True faith is indestructible. The believe may undergo severe tests and trials, but instead of destroying his faith, they become food for faith to feed on. The genuineness of faith can be proved only by fire. When prevailing conditions are favorable [Johnny: such as good health and adequate income. I was a fundamentalist Christian for over 35 years. I gave up Christianity for health reasons.], it might be easy to be a Christian. But when public confession of Christ brings persecution and suffering, then the casual followers drift away and are lost in the crowd. A religion which costs nothing is worth nothing. Faith which refuses to pay the price is spurious It is the kind of say-so faith that James condemns.�

Webster’s Online Dictionary defines the word “spurious� as follows:

1: of illegitimate birth: bastard

2. outwardly similar or corresponding to something without having its genuine qualities: false

3. a: of falsified or erroneously attributed origin: forgered. b: of a deceitful nature or quality

James 2:14 says “What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?� William MacDonald says “In other words, can that kind of faith’ save? If it can be asked what kind of faith James is referring to, the answer is found in the first part of the verse. He is speaking about a ‘say-so’ faith that is not backed up by good works. Such a faith is worthless. It is all words, and nothing else.�

Well, MacDonald said it better than I ever could. Although I didn’t quote him, he agreed with you that salvation is obtained by faith alone. You said that good works are not causal regarding obtaining salvation. MacDonald and I agree with you. One of the thieves on the cross was saved by faith alone. However, had the thief survived, the only way that the genuineness of his faith could have been proven is if he had done good works. While good works do not save anybody, they must be done in order to verify a commitment of faith. So, doing good works is required subsequent to salvation if a man wants to confirm that he has in fact already been saved. I should have titled this thread ‘What is required for man to prove that he has been saved?’