Toto

We have hardly any manuscripts from the late 2nd century. We don't know what sort of textual variation there was at that time.

fromdownunder

The whole issue of sourcing the most "accurate" version of the Bible is difficult.

Put simply, it is possible that a third or fourth century manuscript could be more accurate than a second century manuscript because the latter author may had had access to a manuscript that was written in the first century, and thereby have earlier, potentially more accurate source material.

How do we know? How can we ever know?

Norm

judge

By what process do you suggest that variants were destroyed, so that not one variation of this survived.

Who would have had such power?

What specific time would this have occurred.

I think we eill find insurmountable obstacles if we try to be firm about details here, making this a poor theory IMHO

Julian

We can never know for certain, however, accepting a few sensible, simple rules we can make some very educated guesses. Here are the Text Crit rules from Metzger and Aland (from http://www.earlham.edu/~seidti/iam/text_crit.html ):

Metzger Criteria

1. EXTERNAL EVIDENCE, involving considerations bearing upon:
   1. The date of the witness or, rather, of the type of text.
   2. The geographical distribution of the witnesses that agree in supporting a variant.
   3. The genealogical relationship of texts and families of witnesses: Witnesses are weighed rather than counted.
2. INTERNAL EVIDENCE, involving two kinds of probabilities:
   1. Transcriptional Probabilities depend upon considerations of palaeographical details and the habits of scribes. Thus:
      1. In general the more difficult reading is to be preferred.
      2. In general the shorter reading is to be preferred.
      3. That reading is to be preferred which stands in verbal dissidence with the other.
   2. Intrinsic Probabilities depend upon considerations of what the author was more likely to have written, taking into account:
      1. the style and vocabulary of the author throughout the book,
      2. the immediate context,
      3. harmony with the usage of the author elsewhere, and, in the Gospels,
      4. the Aramaic background of the teaching of Jesus,
      5. the priority of the Gospel according to Mark, and
      6. the influence of the Christian community upon the formulation and transmission of the passage in question.

Metzger, The Text of the New Testament, pp. 209-210.


Twelve Basic Rules of Aland/Aland

1. Only one reading can be original, however many variant readings there may be.
2. Only the readings which best satisfies the requirements of both external and internal criteria can be original.
3. Criticism of the text must always begin from the evidence of the manuscript tradition and only afterward turn to a consideration of internal criteria.
4. Internal criteria (the context of the passage, its style and vocabulary, the theological environment of the author, etc.) can never be the sole basis for a critical decision, especially when they stand in opposition to the external evidence.
5. The primary authority for a critical textual decision lies with the Greek manuscript tradition, with the version and Fathers serving no more than a supplementary and corroborative function, particularly in passages where their underlying Greek text cannot be reconstructed with absolute certainty.
6. Furthermore, manuscripts should be weighed, not counted, and the peculiar traits of each manuscript should be duly considered. However important the early papyri, or a particular uncial, or a minuscule may be, there is no single manuscript or group or manuscripts that can be followed mechanically, even though certain combinations of witnesses may deserve a greater degree of confidence than others. Rather, decisions in textual criticism must be worked out afresh, passage by passage (the local principle).
7. The principle that the original reading may be found in any single manuscript or version when it stands alone or nearly alone is only a theoretical possibility. Any form of eclecticism which accepts this principle will hardly succeed in establishing the original text of the New Testament; it will only confirm the view of the text which it presupposes.
8. The reconstruction of a stemma of readings for each variant (the genealogical principle) is an extremely important device, because the reading which can most easily explain the derivation of the other forms is itself most likely the original.
9. Variants must never be treated in isolation, but always considered in the context of the tradition. Otherwise there is too great a danger of reconstructing a "test tube text" which never existed at any time or place.
10. There is truth in the maxim: lectio difficilior lectio potior ("the more difficult reading is the more probable reading"). But this principle must not be taken too mechanically, with the most difficult reading (lectio difficilima) adopted as original simply because of its degree of difficulty.
11. The venerable maxim lectio brevior lectio potior ("the shorter reading is the more probable reading") is certainly right in many instances. But here again the principle cannot be applied mechanically.
12. A constantly maintained familiarity with New Testament manuscripts themselves is the best training for textual criticism. In textual criticism the pure theoretician has often done more harm than good.

Kurt Aland and Barbara Aland, The Text of the New Testament, pp. 275-276.

Julian

Toto

William Walker finds no such insurmountable obstacles.

Interpolations in the Pauline Epistles

judge

Well there is an insurmountable obstacle.

No one can provide a theory as to how this might have occurred.

No one can suggest any details of any person or organisation that could possibly have done this.

Toto

The organization is the Christian Church. You've heard of it?

judge

There was no one Christian Church at that time...or at any time in history.

There were various competing independent organisations and communties. They were not in communion, they had different councils and different canons and different theologies and different geographies.

You will have to try again.

So no, I have not heard of this organisation.

Do you really believe it existed as you portray it?

Toto

I think that the parapharase from Walker answers all of your objections.

Do we have any of the competing versions of Paul's letters? We don't have Marcion's version, except as can be reconstructed from his orthodox opponents.

judge

Are you talking about abridged versions or competing versions?



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