BlessNot

Just face the facts. Jesus is never coming back. It's just one hugh hoax.

Decypher

You haven't addressed the relevant point. If the Old Testament prophets were accurate, then what they predicted would certainly need to come to pass. I'm sure we can both agree on that point. But where on earth do you get the idea that everything predicted would have had to come to pass in the world today?

Decypher

Sheshbazzar, the problem with this is that you have added, "and had came to pass at any time prior to this present day", as your own invention. That isn't something that I put forward.

I merely suggested that the Old Testament prophets were accurate, which obviously involves that what they predicted would happen at some point. But it doesn't necessarily require that what they predicted would already have happened. Could you please explain where you are getting that part from?

Decypher

Could you answer this? I'm really not sure that you are actually following the Bible.

Sheshbazzar

You still appear to laboring under the seriously mistaken assumption that my position regarding the Bible (ie, "the books") is identical to, or is somewhat similar to those views of "The Book(s)" that are held by mainstream "Christians", as stated within their various "creeds" and "Statements of Doctrine".

Yesterday in reply to a pm, I provided another poster here with this answer to a similar inquiry. Ultimately, my (our) faith does not rest in any confidence in old books, but in our convictions in the things that are written upon the living tablets of our hearts, minds, and conscience.
As with father Abraham, (and it makes not one whit of difference if you believe him to be mythological, nor even if he was mythological) whose faith and convictions were not founded upon words written within old books, but in a personal walk and experience in listening to and in obeying the living Voice of Him that led him.
If atheists, X-ians, and Jews want, or need to wrangle over the interpretations and meanings of the ancient writings, We say, (but not us alone) let them gainsay for this is that hour that has been given to the gainsayers to prevail in their confusions.
If they are not hearing that quiet, small Voice speaking to them, saying;
"This is the way, walk you in it." then their long and doubtful disputations and arguments about the meanings and variations to be found within old documents, is the paltry sum of their spiritual experience;
These, in their short sighted pursuits, like to apply and abuse the texts to their own ends; Seeking with whom they might find fault, and whom they might exclude, and mock. (or just feel superior to)
But we that receive The Word of Life written into our hearts, seek among all of mankind, whom we might love, receive, pardon, and give good words of comfort against present distress.
Amongst our number are counted the weak, the blind, the deaf, the simple minded, illiterate, and innocent children ripped from their mothers wombs, all who cannot see, hear, read, nor willfully take up foolish arguments against their Maker, nor against His Word.
Do they all know us? No, but it suffices that we that know Him, and hear His Voice, ("My sheep hear My Voice") accept and receive them on His behalf, whom He wills to reveal His mercy upon.
That in the day of the revealing of all things, the proud, the arrogant, the wise in their own eyes, might be humbled and shamed before Him, when they shall see these, the least esteemed among men, gathered unto him, while they, the "wise" are refused.
Yes indeed, no such argument will ever persuade me against the Voice of my Master and Saviour YAH-YAHha'oshua The Messiah, who writes upon my heart, and speaks into my ears, within Whose hand I am, that no man may pluck me therefrom;
If therefore the words of my Master seem "against the Bible" (that is, your idea of what "The Bible" teaches) then it is yet the Voice of my Master that I will hear and will obey, against (your) "The Bible"
Really, you are not accusing me of anything that your fathers did not also accuse Him of.

Decypher

I was actually saying that your attitude was going against the Bible. Yes, what I mentioned is indeed "my idea" of what the Bible teaches, but "my idea" of what the Bible teaches is taken from the plain meaning of the text and almost certainly what the Bible DOES teach. If your personal religion allows you to ignore anything you don't like in the Bible, well fine, but don't pretend that what I say is merely "my idea" of the Bible.

I think it is a shame that you ignore Deuteronomy 18:21-22, because it is one part of the Bible that expects us to be somewhat critical when it comes to self-proclaimed prophets. But I guess you aren't interested in that...

Decypher

Sheshbazzar, are you going to answer this?

All I have been suggesting as a possible option is that Judaism is true, and Christianity is false. There are actually many people called "Jews" who believe exactly this! I can't see why you object to this as a possible option.

Sheshbazzar

This will be my final post to this thread.
Anyone reading this thread from the beginning will be aware that my position and argument from the beginning has been;
1. That the apocalyptic predictions of The Holy Prophets "DID NOT" and "HAVE NOT came to pass" at any time in the past. (see the arguments and conclusions regarding the subject of preterism earlier within this thread)

2. That the apocalyptic predictions of The Holy Prophets "HAVE NOT came to pass" in the world of today. (How many times, and in how many ways have I clearly declared that "these things DID NOT and HAVE NOT came to pass"?)

There is a serious flaw in your suggestion and "option", The predictions of The Holy Prophets may be accurate, true, and ultimately "come to pass", without all the rest of the false and foolish ideas, traditions and teachings of the religion of "Judaism" being "right" or "true".
Indeed The Holy Prophets are they that bare witness against the "religion" of the fathers of "Judaism", repeatedly rebuking the false religiosity of their countrymen the Jews; they are still swallowing camels.
As for the "Christianity is false" you are still attempting to argue the premise with the wrong individual, in as much as I have already agreed to that in this previous post; In our view "Christianity" is the "apostasy" predicted to gain and prevail amongst the Believers, until His appearing when shall it be revealed for the farce that it is, In the Day that they say unto Him; "LORD, Lord, have we not done great works in your name?" and He shall say "Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity." And in that Day YAH shall prove to be One and His Name One, The Salvation of His people, upon whom His Name is called.

Decypher

Well perhaps you have another option with that, but that does nothing to show a "serious flaw" in the possible option that I suggested. If you want to show a "flaw" in what I said then you obviously need to give a reason why it can't be a possibility.

Decypher

You misunderstand. I wasn't arguing that Christianity was false. I was merely arguing that Judaism being true was a possible option. (Something you didn't seem to allow for.)