Lógos Sokratikós

Jewish website "SimpleToRemember" asked the Pope about the contradictions in the gospels, declined to answer but refererred them to the dominican École Biblique who in turn declined, and refererred them to Dan Brown Raymond Brown (excuse me) and the result was this:


http://www.simpletoremember.com/vita...redibility.htm

... in short, total admision of contradiction and pious myth-making. And remembering that the RCC was responsible of setting up the canon of the New Testament, I'm itching to write a Q.E.D. at the end of this post.


Looks like I did after all.
Lógos Sokratikós

gstafleu

Interesting article, thanks for posting that.
So, the RCC agrees that the HJ was at least in part derived from myth. Plus, I have learned a new word: theologoumenon. The HJ is a theologoumenon, have to remember that.

The RCC is here ahead of at least some members of this forum, who, on occasion, profess some difficulty with the idea that the virgin birth may have "pagan" origins. Well, BC&H is of course a rather Sola Scriptura enterprise, so perhaps no surprise here .

Gerard Stafleu

Chili

You can't really expect the Pope to tell believers that it entire story is metaphor and that must take place in their head for it to become true because they would never come back for seconds. Besides that it would contradict the hot/cold passage wherein cold is good without having entered the race. I mean, if one doesn't start the race how can one finish it?

Lucretius

I like this bit as well

Chili

But even with pagan origins there must be an underlying truth to it and this the Pope would not tell. Of course the Church knows but would much rather not say than remove the mystery of faith.

We all know that rebirth is easy to accept if at times we all feel at least a little bit pregnant with dispair (involutional melancholia they used to call it which now is often is referred to as a yin-yang imbalance). So if rebirth is known to us a rebirth from above and below must also be conceivable since the pregancy was not our wish (or it would not be involutional) and therefore a virgin/non-virgin rebirth must be conceivable.

I suspect that Ecole Biblique send 'Simple to Remember' to Raymond Brown because it is quite normal to be under attack in America.

Chili

The authors witnessed them via nature and reported them as perceived by them for which the event must be prior to us by nature before we can relate to them (Jn.5:39 "they testify on my behalf [only]").

It now becomes a matter of our eyes being opened, fully opened, half shut of fully shut.

Lógos Sokratikós

Who can tell? Who knows how much of Jesus' (the character) thoughts are those of HJ and which aren't? It's prickly, and a matter of probablities. You can't speak on a pulpit and say "X, but that's very improbable He ever said that" and "Y, and this is quite probable, just short of certain that He said it, so you folks should...". A church so managed cannot stand.

Lógos Sokratikós

I'm glad that for the first time in a thousand seven hundred years, Jews can finally speak out in the face of Christian claims.

Chili

Who can tell? To adopt the concept as one of your own is to be in agreement with it. The historical Jesus 'was', of course, but what he really said doesn't matter as much as what the story claims he said. The HJ is very insignicifant but just an important manifestation of truth at that time which we have increased very much since that time. So yes, it is real, and in Rome She stands.