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Old 03-26-2012, 05:12 PM   #1
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Default The phallic 'Savior of the World' hidden in the Vatican

I think the artefact should be dated.
In which century was it fashioned?
Was it a Gnostic satire?

Thanks must go particularly to Acharya S (and to Dave31) for their attention to the scholarship on this subject. Acharya S has recently posted a blog on this subject here. It makes an intriguing read quite aside from the squabbles in the chookyard of self-professed authoritative biblical scholars.


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Originally Posted by Acharya S's blogsite

Hidden in the Vatican

In Studies in Iconography (7-8:94), published by Northern Kentucky University, after discussing this "Savior of the World" artifact, the author comments:

This object was published under papal and royal authority, exhibited for a time in the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries, and is now said to be held inaccessible in the secret collections of the Vatican. During the public life of this bronze, officials disagreed upon the probity of the exhibit. One offended cardinal requested that the object be removed...

The writer (95) further states that "the Vatican Saviour-as-Phallic-cock was a scandalous satire on early Christians." We are therefore justified in bringing up this artifact and wondering why it would serve as "satire on early Christians," if not for the reasons stated here.

Thanks very much again to Acharya's attention to scholarship about this artefact self-captioned as 'Savior of the World' . In another book, Ehrman's attention to scholarship mentioned further phallic references in "The Greater Questions of Mary".



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I am not completely unappreciative--it is great that Acharya S did the detective work to backtrack the claim to 19th century sources...
That's false, if you read the blog she traces back much farther than that.
It wasn't nearly as easy to track down in 1999 as it is today. The fact remains that Errorman didn't even check into this at all. Errorman failed to even notice that Acharya did cite someone else for the drawling i.e. Walker.

Dr. Robert Price is right, Ehrman's book is a "hack job," so Abe, are you going to harass Errorman for it for years on end like you have been with Acharya for what like 8 years? What Ehrman did by falsely accusing her of making it up is libelous, which is far worse than anything Acharya S has ever done.
Errorman (*laugh*) accused Acharya S of sourcing from other authors that like to make things up, and I have no disagreement, so, no, I won't be harassing Errorman.
Quote:
* "'Peter' is not only 'the rock' but also 'the cock,' or penis, as the word is used as slang to this day." Here Acharya shows (her own?) hand drawing of a man with a rooster head but with a large erect penis instead of a nose, with this description: "Bronze sculpture hidden in the Vatican treasure of the Cock, symbol of St. Peter" (295). [There is no penis-nosed statue of Peter the cock in the Vatican or anywhere else except in books like this, which love to make things up.]

- Bart Ehrman, Did Jesus Exist?
Errorman makes no mention of: "sourcing from other authors."

There's no way around it, Errorman did a "hack job" with this book as Dr. Price says and Errorman completely got this one wrong and embarrassed himself in the process because he got it sooooo sloppily and egregiously wrong.

No surprise that you (AAbe & others here) would be incapable of acknowledging that Acharya S wasn't wrong here and that she may be correct about anything. No surprise with your hypocritical inconsistency of giving Errorman a free pass on something far worse than Acharya has ever done yet, you still harass her 8 years later just because you lost a debate 8 years ago. It's just another demonstration of the severe biases, discrimination and misogyny here and elsewhere. How long ya going to keep riding that little scooter?

The phallic 'Savior of the World' hidden in the Vatican
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Old 03-27-2012, 10:05 PM   #2
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As if we didn't already know from the content of the book that Christianity is for cock-faces.

... and as if we didn't already know that a well placed cock can do the world a lot of good.
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Old 03-29-2012, 02:42 PM   #3
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Wasn't there a pope who put fig leaves on all the statuary genitals?
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Old 03-31-2012, 04:40 AM   #4
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FWIW Inscriptiones Graecae volume XIV (14) published 1890 page 13 number 116 lists the "Saviour of the World" artefact as a supposed forgery Spuriam Esse Credo.

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Old 03-31-2012, 05:42 AM   #5
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They would say that, wouldn't they? Can't rock the boat of Christianity!
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Old 03-31-2012, 05:58 AM   #6
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They would say that, wouldn't they? Can't rock the boat of Christianity!
Inscriptiones Graecae is a vast catalogue of Greek inscriptions with brief descriptions. volume 14 (covering mainly Italian and Sicilian inscriptions) begins with many pages of spurious and doubtful inscriptions, most of them raising no issues of religious controversy. Is its verdict on spurious inscription 116 prima facie more unsound than its verdicts on the c. 115 previous dodgy inscriptions or the many subsequent inscriptions classed as doubtful or false ?

I am not saying that one should automatically believe Inscriptiones Graecae here. But it is the standard reference on the subject.

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Old 03-31-2012, 07:10 AM   #7
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Mockery?

Wikipedia has an article on the Alexamenos graffito or graffito blasfemo.

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Old 04-01-2012, 04:16 AM   #8
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They would say that, wouldn't they? Can't rock the boat of Christianity!
Inscriptiones Graecae is a vast catalogue of Greek inscriptions with brief descriptions. volume 14 (covering mainly Italian and Sicilian inscriptions) begins with many pages of spurious and doubtful inscriptions, most of them raising no issues of religious controversy. Is its verdict on spurious inscription 116 prima facie more unsound than its verdicts on the c. 115 previous dodgy inscriptions or the many subsequent inscriptions classed as doubtful or false ?

I am not saying that one should automatically believe Inscriptiones Graecae here. But it is the standard reference on the subject.

Andrew Criddle
Which means, of course, that Acharaya S is wrong to say the Vatican is hiding it. More likely, the Vatican threw it out.
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Old 04-01-2012, 04:21 AM   #9
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Mockery?

Wikipedia has an article on the Alexamenos graffito or graffito blasfemo.

It looks like Alexamenos is blowing him a "bon voyage" kiss! Now which god is this? Jesus Christ, or Typhon-Seth?

http://jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/2027-ass-worship
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Old 04-01-2012, 11:03 AM   #10
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Coincidence.

הסוס h s u s pronounced ha'Sooce, translates as 'The Horse'.

The letter H 'heh' of the ancient Semitic alphabet became the letter E of the Greek and Latin alphabets.

הסוס hasus of the Hebrew becomes in Greek/Latin 'easus'.

'The Horse (Ea'sus) is worthless for salvation, and in his great strength is no escape' (Psalm 33:17)

'The Horse (Ea'sus) is set up for the day of war: but Deliverance is of YHWH.' (Prov 21:31)

'And with you will I break in pieces The Horse (Ea'sus) and his retinue; and with you will I break in pieces the retinue and his rider; (Jer 51:21)

'Who brings forth the chariot and horse, The army and the power (They shall lie down together, they shall not rise; They are extinguished, they are quenched like a wick):' (Isa 43:17)

'Dan shall be a serpent by the way, A viper by the path, That bites the heels of the Horse, So that its rider shall fall backward.' (Gen 49:17)
(There are more)

'A Horse' is a Horse of course of course.......except when it isn't.
And a 'chariot' is a chariot of course of course.......except when it isn't.

Pity those that ride 'The Horse' (Ea'sus) and those in the 'chariot' that follows, for The Horse (Ea'sus), chariots, and the riders all shall be cast into the sea.

'Remember ye not the former things, neither consider the things of old.'

All these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.'

Hmmm.
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