Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Bones22 · 07-21-2007, 10:51 PM

I'm new here so I don't know all the rules yet, but I love discussing contradictory biblical passages that I simply don't think can be harmonized.

Here's one that has to do with the resurrection accounts being discussed in this thread:
Matthew 28:9
"And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him."
John 20:17
"Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and [to] my God, and your God."

Your thoughts.
Bones22

Chili · 07-21-2007, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ynquirer

Those issues of either authenticity or sheer invention, and of honesty or forgery too much resemble the half-full/half-empty bottle. For even though it is true that the gospelers changed many details, possibly in the pursuance of different theological agendas, it on the one hand may not be denied that there is a core story - say, youth in Nazareth, baptism in the Jordan, disciples, preaching in Galilee, arrival in Jerusalem, arrest and trial, crucifixion, empty tomb - in which all of them agreed, and on the other hand later Christians, in the pursuance of a unified, orthodox agenda, could have harmonized the official story, and they failed to do so.

I think it is very harmonized if you do away with the synoptic idea that is contrived for the mentally handicapped (oblivion or fallen nature they called it).

The gospels are just different perspectives of the event wherein Matthew is the formal cause, Mark the material cause, Luke the efficient cause and John the final casue. And you know what? The apparent contradiction become affirmations if seen from the perspective that they were written.

For example, if the wedding in Cana takes place in the subconscious mind it is easy to see that it is desert-time in the conscious mind and that not even the possible gain of material wealth could sway Jesus to return to reason.

EternallyI · 07-21-2007, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bones22

I'm new here so I don't know all the rules yet, but I love discussing contradictory biblical passages that I simply don't think can be harmonized.

Here's one that has to do with the resurrection accounts being discussed in this thread:
Matthew 28:9
"And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him."
John 20:17
"Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and [to] my God, and your God."

Your thoughts.
Bones22

No contradiction.
"Then he said to Thomas,'Put your fingers here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.'" Jn 20:27

Toto · 07-22-2007, 01:22 AM

Hi Bones22 - welcome to II. Your post seems to raise a new issue, so I put it in its own thread.

And yes, I think there is a contradiction there.

Sven · 07-22-2007, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EternallyI

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bones22

I'm new here so I don't know all the rules yet, but I love discussing contradictory biblical passages that I simply don't think can be harmonized.

Here's one that has to do with the resurrection accounts being discussed in this thread:
Matthew 28:9
"And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him."
John 20:17
"Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and [to] my God, and your God."

Your thoughts.
Bones22

No contradiction.
"Then he said to Thomas,'Put your fingers here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.'" Jn 20:27

How on Earth does this resolve the contradiction? :huh: Only Thomas was supposed to touch him, and only at his side, not at his feet.

It actually creates an additional (internal) contradiction in John: First, Jesus says not to touch him, then he commands Thomas to touch him. Split personality, anyone?

07-21-2007, 10:51 PM	#1
Bones22 New Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bloomington, Illinois Posts: 1	Hope this is appropriate to post to this thread. I'm new here so I don't know all the rules yet, but I love discussing contradictory biblical passages that I simply don't think can be harmonized. Here's one that has to do with the resurrection accounts being discussed in this thread: Matthew 28:9 "And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him." John 20:17 "Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and [to] my God, and your God." Your thoughts. Bones22

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07-22-2007, 01:22 AM	#4
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Hi Bones22 - welcome to II. Your post seems to raise a new issue, so I put it in its own thread. And yes, I think there is a contradiction there.

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