judge

What evidence do you yourself, base this "probably" on?

I know you quoted someone else briefly mentioning the book of maccabees, but can you be more precise?

Thanks

steve_bnk

By looking on what we see today and know of with good certainty back several centuries now, and from historical documents and archeology of Jeruslaem and the region.

At the time of JC Jeruslem is belived to have been a commerce and trade center. From what I've read Arameic was a common regional trade language. One only has to look at San Francisco, New York, and New Orleans over the last 200 years.

Trade centers out of need tend to be muli-lingual. JC was reputtedly debating the rabbais on their own ground in the syngaoues infering literacy. From Shebazzer's analysis it was likly the core of the rabinical community would be conversant in Hebrew, again allowing an infernce that JC spoke Hebrew.

Keep in mind the question is what would JC have spoken given some credence of the NT, not if JC actualy existed.

Rome at the time was cosmopolitan. The close apostles quickly spread out in their evangelical missions infering again a need for multiple languages.

The quote/analysis is from Shebazzer who appears to be a knowledgeable Jew. Feel free to email him if you want to question his analysis, I do not think he will mind.

IamJoseph

One section of the Gospels cannot prove another section of the Gospels. Paul arrived in Judea some 35 years after Jesus is said to have passed away, and was imprisoned in Caesaera [a Judean city] by the Romans in 68 CE for two years, then sent to Rome where he was executed along with a group of other Jews on the charge of heresy. That Paul and Jesus never met is common knowledge among historians - I didn't make it up.

There is no means to subscribe anything in the Gospels from any of the alledged writers, to Jesus. All indicators are that if Jesus was a true historical figure from Judea, he would not and could not condone anything in the Gospels, which contains doctrines the Jews rejected and went to numerous wars against with Greece and Rome. Jesus, as a Judean Jew, would not speak or write in Latin in a pink fit, and would not have been able to prevail over Rome's heresy law - as none of the Judean Jews could.

Judean Jews did not worship divine man at any time in their entire history, while Greece and Roman could not exist without this provision. Both Rome and Greece understood this pivotal factor, which was seen as a negation of everything Rome stood for - and thus tried to negate the Hebrew belief by coming up with the Gospels - even saying that it was written by Jews, and making all the Jews as bad guys who killed their own kin over it . Deicide is perhaps the most anti-God and anti-Monotheistic premise ever devised.

Thus you have passages which have nothing whatsoever to do with Godliness, such as 'Jews are born of the devil', while Genesis affirms all life is blessed equally, regardless of their belief systems, and there is no such thing as a devil. Both these documents cannot be equally right: one is a contradiction. On the heels of the Gospels, we have the Quran which says Jews are born of apes and pigs: at least we're getting closer to Darwinism here.

IamJoseph

Just the reverse applies. The stats in Josephus allign with all historical archives of the Roman and Greek writers. The measurements of Jerusalem's Temple precinct, its walls circumference, the sizes of bricks, the names of historical figures in Judea and Rome, the dates of their ceremonies and kings, the number of dead, the armoury of Rome and Judea, are free of even minor errors, and of greater value and credibility than anything from Europe.

IamJoseph

No sir! A judge will find that the NT & Quran are totally contradictory from each other and from historical evidences. That Judge will not find the same applying to the Hebrew bible, which is not confronted with contradictions or disputative writings of its own space times.


True that a religion resting solely on belief will continue that belief, whatever evidence is forthcoming. One reason here is those religions were established on forceful conversions - and the peoples made no demand for proof, or were not allowed to.

This is not the case with the Hebrew writings - it is regarded as historical, despite some miracles being listed - the miracles are surrounded by true historical factors, its relics alligning with history - as was seen in the dead sea scrolls which gave new documents not seen before - like the Temple scrolls and the Copper scrolls; the scrolls also negated anything stated in the Gospels by a total vacancy of evidences.

steve_bnk

Sherlock Holmes was surrounded by know historical artifcats and was reputed to perform fearts of mental analysis far beyond mortal humans.

Superman was surrounded by known historical atrifacts ans winesses in the comic books attest to his being able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.

The Wizard Of Oz conatins known historical references.


Homer's adventures have been linked to archeological sites.

The Koran considers Mohammed the last in the line of the prophets starting with Abraham and including JC.

spamandham

None of this matters. No human writer can be expected to be absolutely accurate.

Worse than that, Josephus mentions several matters of nonsense, such as flying chariots, the absurd story of Jesus son of Ananus, the story of the woman who ate her own child, ....and many others.

I doubt that even 1 serious scholar has elevated Josephus to inerrant status in the way you claim "numerous" scholars have done.

spamandham

The Hebrew scriptures contain internal and external contradictions. I can't expect *you* to acknowledge these, but an unbiased judge certainly would.

IamJoseph

I can give you 10 of these - would it suffice?

IamJoseph

You will have a hard time proving something which is not shown as your evidence. My understanding is that nothing in the Hebrew bible has ever been disproven, and more than 70% has already been proven. Can you give an example of any other ancient writings showing an equivalence with the Hebrew: choose from wherever you like - even writings a 1000 years later?