GenesisNemesis

I wonder why Nuwanda hasn't shown me where she's seen these miracles.

Kosh

Apparently, there were no other witnesses either.

dzim77

After browsing the thread I found this page on the web...

Sorry it's nothing well-researched but thought some might find it interesting.

http://www.geocities.com/meta_crock/other/miracles5.htm

The site is pretty amateurish, but apparently the guy (Dr. H. Richard Casdorph) wrote a book called "Real Miracles" listing thoroughly documented medical evidence of miracle healings by Kathryn Kuhlman.

Amazon link (or via: amazon.co.uk)

anybody heard of this before?

GenesisNemesis

Why haven't I heard of it? :huh:

Wikipedia: Kathryn Johanna Kuhlman (May 9, 1907 - February 20, 1976) was a 20th Century American evangelist. She believed in miracles and deliverance by the power of the Holy Spirit, and was part of the Pentecostal arm of Protestant Christianity. She was born in Concordia, Missouri to German parents and died in Tulsa, Oklahoma, following open-heart surgery.

Ironic?

dzim77

Yeah, I don't know. I haven't heard of it either but I've never really looked into this issue.

It could be wacko, but at 5.99, I may have to buy it and see?? Probably an interesting read in any case.

dzim77

While we're on the topic. Here's a great book. He's one of the original 'underground church' leaders in China.

This guy's autobiography reads like the book of Acts. Miracles, mass conversions, persecution, you name it. It's up to you whether you take his word for it of course...
.
The Heavenly Man: The Remarkable True Story of Chinese Christian Brother Yun (or via: amazon.co.uk)

Kosh

Notice that "meta-crock" in the URL? He's pertty notorious around this obard.

IN fact, I think we may have had a thread discussing these claims.

jjramsey

The problem is that, except perhaps for the cancer, the conditions that you describe are not visible, and what we know about them is filtered through you. We don't know whether the arms you saw were really crushed, or whether you simply thought they were at the time. Worse, your mind is likely to have streamlined the memory of the event so that what you think you remember is consistent with what you think was supposed to have happened, while forgetting details that would have been tells to us that what more mundane things might have happened. That you describe cancer as falling off seems suspicious, since cancers are usually internal. One is left to wonder what actually fell off, or if "fell off" is a colorful description.

This too is telling. Healings of internal problems are once-removed hearsay. Healings of even more impressive miracles, those of visible conditions, are at least twice-removed hearsay.

lpetrich

How is it that miracles have such a big shyness effect? Why don't miracles ever happen out in the open?

Especially big ones

Like giving everybody 20/20 vision or restoring every amputated limb or making every hospital patient jump out of bed in good health.

But why are you claiming that those alleged miracles had happened?

Which ones? And one would have to show that those records were not some pious frauds or some misunderstandings somewhere. Yes, pious frauds. There has been a LONG history of them, like fake relics in the Middle Ages. In a church in Italy there used to be the bones of a certain St. Rosalia, which had curative powers. But they retained those powers even after some anatomist hd shown them to be the bones of a goat. (Source: Andrew Dickson White, The Warfare of Science with Theology in Christendom)

So it's all a matter of will to believe?

We don't have what they said about those alleged miracles.

And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.

What a petulant weenie Jesus Christ was. He ought to have been more mature.

And maybe you'll learn a thing or two in that time.

douglas

It does make you long for the good old days, doesn't it? When God's presence on earth was more obvious - destroying armies, leveling cities, etc. These days, we're reduced to squinting at burnt grilled cheese sandwiches and water stains on the side of the road. (sigh)