Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Clivedurdle · 03-10-2007, 12:49 PM

Apologies if we have been here, but I don't remember it - saw this book in a shop this afternoon.

Quote:

From a prominent scholar, a provocative argument that the Biblical characters of Jesus and David should be viewed not as historical figures, but as embodiments of Babylonian, Egyptian, and Near Eastern traditions.

Since the eighteenth century, scholars and historians studying the texts of the Bible have attempted to distill historical facts and biography from the mythology and miracles described there. That trend continues into the present day, as scholars such as those of the "Jesus Seminar" dissect the Gospels and other early Christian writings to separate the "Jesus of history" from the "Christ of faith." But with The Messiah Myth, noted Biblical scholar Thomas L. Thompson argues that the quest for the historical Jesus is beside the point, since the Jesus of the Gospels never existed.

Like King David before him, says Thompson, the Jesus of the Bible is an amalgamation of themes from Near Eastern mythology and traditions of kingship and divinity. The theme of a messiah-a divinely appointed king who restores the world to perfection-is typical of Egyptian and Babylonian royal ideology dating back to the Bronze Age. In Thompson's view, the contemporary audience for whom the Old and New Testament were written would naturally have interpreted David and Jesus not as historical figures, but as metaphors embodying long-established messianic traditions. Challenging widely held assumptions about the sources of the Bible and the quest for the historical Jesus, The Messiah Myth is sure to spark interest and heated debate.

The Messiah Myth: The Near Eastern Roots of Jesus and David (or via: amazon.co.uk)

Chili · 03-10-2007, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clivedurdle

Apologies if we have been here, but I don't remember it - saw this book in a shop this afternoon.

The Messiah Myth: The Near Eastern Roots of Jesus and David (or via: amazon.co.uk)

Be careful here with the word "existence" because if Jesus is the way it/he still exists today. Here again, 2+2=4 exists and is as true today as it is tomorrow.

If we look at the Gopels as a divine comedy for which there are no words because it is beyond the grasp of our faculty of reason that itself must be nihilated in the event it becomes easy to understand why the mythmaker had to use conventional words to describe the event and use them in such a way as to paint mental pictures (parables and metaphors) to present the image he tries to convey.

Clivedurdle · 03-11-2007, 03:17 AM

Quote:

Like King David before him, says Thompson, the Jesus of the Bible is an amalgamation of themes from Near Eastern mythology and traditions of kingship and divinity. The theme of a messiah-a divinely appointed king who restores the world to perfection-is typical of Egyptian and Babylonian royal ideology dating back to the Bronze Age. In Thompson's view, the contemporary audience for whom the Old and New Testament were written would naturally have interpreted David and Jesus not as historical figures, but as metaphors embodying long-established messianic traditions.

Is this accepted?

mountainman · 03-11-2007, 02:53 PM

This and all other approaches of a "woven myth from old traditions"
must still deal with whatever Eusebius and Constantine did to the
transmission of "christian information" in the fourth century, and in
fact carry their thesis down to the year 330 CE at which time the
new and the old series of books were first bound together.

What does Thomas L. Thompson say of Eusebius' role in the transmission
of his proposed "Messiah Myth" in his thesis. It is quite clear to all parties
that all Historical Jesus theories are necessarily dependent upon the
"Eusebian chronology of new testament events" for the prenicene epoch.

It is nowhere near as clear that in fact many Mythical Jesus theories also
take on board --- at the postulate level --- the essences of the Eusebian
chronology, for example Earl Doherty's theory and arguments from a
mythicist position.

And it should be quite obvious to all parties that any theory of the
transmission of "any and all christian 'information'", in order to be quite
complete, must deal with the period of time leading up to the time of
330 CE, when the bible was first historically written out in full in Greek,
and bound together.

Toto · 03-11-2007, 03:10 PM

There was a lot of discussion of this book last year when it came out.

Start here and follow the links: Put 'Thompson Messsiah myth' in the search engine.

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03-11-2007, 02:53 PM	#4
mountainman Contributor Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Falls Creek, Oz. Posts: 11,192	This and all other approaches of a "woven myth from old traditions" must still deal with whatever Eusebius and Constantine did to the transmission of "christian information" in the fourth century, and in fact carry their thesis down to the year 330 CE at which time the new and the old series of books were first bound together. What does Thomas L. Thompson say of Eusebius' role in the transmission of his proposed "Messiah Myth" in his thesis. It is quite clear to all parties that all Historical Jesus theories are necessarily dependent upon the "Eusebian chronology of new testament events" for the prenicene epoch. It is nowhere near as clear that in fact many Mythical Jesus theories also take on board --- at the postulate level --- the essences of the Eusebian chronology, for example Earl Doherty's theory and arguments from a mythicist position. And it should be quite obvious to all parties that any theory of the transmission of "any and all christian 'information'", in order to be quite complete, must deal with the period of time leading up to the time of 330 CE, when the bible was first historically written out in full in Greek, and bound together.

03-11-2007, 03:10 PM	#5
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	There was a lot of discussion of this book last year when it came out. Start here and follow the links: Put 'Thompson Messsiah myth' in the search engine.

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