sugarhitman

That would prove that He exist...Johnny....which is the point of this OP.

sugarhitman

In the days of Christ, there were Jews who lived in other lands other than Israel....but guess what...it was still refered to as ISRAEL which had been restored thanks to Cyrus. It does not matter if Jews decide to live in other lands, it does not matter if some Jews opposed Israel (many Jews in other countries are dual citizens) Israel is what it is....The Nation of Israel.

Sheshonq

Not the same thing.

Today, the MAJORITY of Jews do NOT live in the modern state of Israel.

Hardly a return then, when the majority of the so-called returnees have decided not to return.

BWAHAHAHAHAAAA!

blastula

Even if you accept that weaselness, where's the one king? This one king was supposed to rule at the same time as the restoration.

sugarhitman

Um, the largest concetration of Jews is in Israel. And many Jews living outside Israel are themselves citizens of that country....The Nation of Israel is restored...just as foretold thousands of years before...which proves that the God of the BIBLE lives.

By the way, what proofs for Allah are there in the Quran?

sugarhitman

Have you not read the Prophets? This King appears when Israel is being attacked by (after their restoration) ALL nations.....Armegeddon is the time when He appears.

Sheshbazzar

And those Jews who have returned are descendants of the tribe of Judah and of the half tribe of Benjamin, or are "converts" or the descendants of converts to the Jewish religion.
The other ten tribes have been long since interbred and been absorbed into the populations of the nations they were scattered to.
Yep, perhaps you are a descendant from a man or woman from, the Tribe of Issachar, only sixty or more generations removed.
Think maybe if you have .001% of Israelite "Lost Tribe" DNA, that you are one of that lost tribe ?
If so, then its not doing you a hell of a lot of good to be claiming to be a "Christian", and preaching and teaching that "adoption" by which all "believing" gentiles are to receive their heritage in Israel, as you already have your free, and unearned "PASS" to The Promises, based simply upon whom your great great great great great great great great great great great great great etc..............grand parent happened to be.

blastula

Until they are ruled by a king, Israel is not restored yet according to Ezekiel. That prophecy is unfulfilled.

What this thread title should be is "Israel someday could be evidence of God's existence." And I say evidence "not proof" because it would be just one piece of circumstantial evidence. There's nothing extraordinary about nations being restored. Empires rise and fall and rise again. It's like if someone 50 years ago said "God told me the Boston Red Sox would win the Series again."

Definitive proof would be the whole Armageddon thing and Jesus coming back on clouds of glory and tossing people into the lake of fire. Until then, healing of amputees would make a good case.

Johnny Skeptic

But I already agreed for the sake of argument that a God exists, and that he can predict the future. What does the ability to predict the future have to do with good character? Why would a God who has good character make 100% disputable prophecies when he could easily make 100% indisuputable prophecies. I wish to distinguish disputable prophecies from false prophecies. A false prophecy is a prophecy that does not come true. A disputable prophecy does not necessarily have to be a false prophecy. Even if all Bible prophecies are true prophecies, they have needlessly failed to convince the vast majority of the people in the world that they are true prophecies. If Jesus had accurately predicted what the names of the Roman emperors would be for the next 200 years, and their dates of birth and death, those would have been indisputable prophecies if we were to define indisputable prophecies as prophecies that could not have been made by humans, and would therefore plausibly have been made by a God. Since the New Testament says that Jesus made some predictions, Christians cannot intelligently argue that if Jesus had predicted what I said, that that would have unfairly interfered with people’s free will. If Jesus had predicted what I said, surely more people would have become Christians. That is a reasonable assumption since historically, many people have accepted all kinds of outlandish religions based upon much less convincing evidence than that. In addition, Nostradamus and Edgar Cayce attracted a lot of followers based upon a lot less convincing evidence than that.

In my opinion, no prophecies at all would be much better than 100% disputable prophecies. That is because the Bible says that God is not the author of confusion (1 Corinthians 14:33), and yet Bible prophecies have needlessly caused lots of confusion. If God could have prevented lots of confusion by making 100% indisputable prophecies, then he is the author of confusion. It is called negligence. We have laws against negligence. I assume that you approve of them.

No rational God would make even one disputable prophecy, let alone 100% disputable prophecies.

Why does God predict the future?

Sheshonq

No it is not.

But have never lived there or even visited. So no "return" has occurred.

Moreover, these 'citizens' you refer to are only citizens because the govt of the modern state of Israel chooses to define citizenship by religious affiliation. This allows Israel to perpetrate a form of apartheid, while claiming to be a secular state.

BZZT. WRONG!

ROFLMAO