mrsonic

were there pagan converts to judaism who were persecuted for converting to judaism?


jane h

if pagans left thier man god worship for judaism, then something transformed them.



"The decrees of Caesar and Augustus protecting the Jewish religion is proof enough of that. The widespread evidence of many Greeks and Romans joining the Jewish faith, adopting Jewish values, worshipping a Jewish God, and revering Jewish heroes and scholars is proof enough of that. Josephus hailed from Judaea and was a Jew, and yet was not a victim of prejudice--to the contrary, the Roman authorities took him into their own. Even the Emperor Titus fell in love with the Jewish princess Berenice, and put her aside only in response to the prejudice of others.

It is worth noting that the evidence for god-fearers (pagan converts or quasi-converts to Judaism) is significant in the first two centuries, unlike the evidence for Christians--which suggests that this class outnumbered Christians for at least a good hundred years or more. See: Margaret Williams, "VII.2. Pagans Sympathetic to Judaism" and "VII.3. Pagan Converts to Judaism," The Jews Among the Greeks and Romans: A Diasporan Sourcebook (or via: amazon.co.uk), 1998: pp. 163-79."

steve_bnk

From a book I read on the history of Chrtistianity there was a time when Judaism became something of a fad religion in Rome. The Jews were admired in part for their strong patriarchal family.

I don't know if Jews were protected per se, I believe at a time they were given some dispensation from the Roman state relgion.

As I like to put it, Rome had two rules.

1. Any group that promoted Roman wealth and stability were supported.
2. Anything interfering with Rule 1 was ruthlessy suppressed.

Diaspora Jews generally fell under Rule 1.

Consider that in the NT when his fellow Jews were out foir his head Paul took refuge in his Roman citizenship.

mountainman

Evidence from the Codex Theodosianus suggests that there were Panhellenic (perhaps a better term than "pagan") converts to Judaism commencing in the early 4th century, with the rise of Constantine's version of "christianity".

Here is a law from the year 315 CE

"Any Jew who stones a Jewish convert to Christianity shall be burned, and no one is allowed to join Judaism."

The prohibition against joining Judaism would not have been necessary unless there were conversions to Judaism in progess. I think that this is evidence that many of the people, faced with a choice of making an alliegance to the imperially sponsored Christian religion, or converting to Judaism, chose the latter.

Here is another law code, this time from 339 CE, just after Constantine bit the dust, possibly poisoned by his brothers, [16.8.6]

Women employed by the government as weavers who were lead away by Jews may return to weaving

What might this suggest?

Toto

The women weavers would have been slaves producing garments for the Roman army. Here is a fuller text, but it is still rather puzzling.

stephan huller

I happen to have a copies of Amnon Linder's The Jews in the legal sources of the early Middle Ages (or via: amazon.co.uk). The preview is here: http://books.google.com/books?id=nSZ...page&q&f=false If you need any further clarification or page references just let me know

The basic gist is that the legislation was created to prevent Jews from having any meaningful authority over Christians. Samaritans were treated far worse.

I think the original question was whether there was any pagan converts to judaism who were persecuted for converting to judaism. The problem with researching something like this is that there limited information. I know for instance that Septimius Severus prevented conversion to Judaism by pagans - but was it enforced? Did it apply to Christians? How was it enforced? I have no data about any of this.

arnoldo

It's puzzling to consider that there is much more evidence for gentile converts to judaism in the first two centuries rather than to christianity. Diamonaid MacCulloch, in his book entitled Christianity:The First Three Thousand Years (or via: amazon.co.uk) writes the following concerning these so called "God-fearers"

semiopen

There seems to be a consensus that the Jews were treated about the same as the Christians.

The Jews got expelled from Rome several times (eg. 139 BCE, 19 CE, 50 CE) but I haven't seen anybody argue that this was persecution. Just legal responses to Jews apparently acting like assholes.

IMHO, once one gets into the fourth century, the anti-Jewish laws don't seem designed to stop an imminent threat of Judaism to gain marketshare at the expense of Christianity. In fact, that seems ludicrous to me.

stephan huller

semiopen,

To be honest I would have expected that Septimius Severus's laws against conversion to Judaism WOULDN'T have applied to Christians. The two groups were already easily distinguished by Celsus (c. 177 CE) and his work was widely influential. Nevertheless there were persecutions in Alexandria, Egypt and North Aftica under Severus. Some have argued that these were connected to the anti-Jewish legislation. But I am not so convinced. The Samaritans suffered greatly under Commodus and Decius. It is uncertain what happened to them in the age of Decius.

What is most unusual however is that the Mishnah was supposed to have been firmly established in this period. You wouldn't expect massive reforms to have been developed in an age of persecution, unless ...

Jaybees

The Khazars underwent a wholesale conversion to Judaism. Koestler wrote at length about that event and its consequences.

stephan huller

Yes, am well aware. My family in Germany in the last century used the term to denote ANY Jew from Eastern Europe as a term of derision. 'Oh so and so is a Ukrainian (Jew).' 'He's not a Jew, he khazerim.' My mom still uses the term to this day not knowing the history. Such regional bigotism is common in cultures. In Italy northerners hate anyone south of Venice. Germans use the adjective 'Polish' to mean anything badly made or organized. In Canada its the Newfies. In England the Irish.

I don't see what any of this has to do with the topic, though