Slojodan

According to scholars, Romans is one of the last, if not the
last, epistles from Paul. We all know the "All of Israel will be saved"
quote, but reading it in it's entire context, it's apparent that Paul's
saying that A) Israel's heart is in the right place when they deny Jesus,
B) It is G-d's intention that Israel denies Jesus, C) It is G-d's DOING that
Israel denies Jesus, and D) The Jews who don't accept Jesus will either get
another chance or will just be forgiven. I've taken quotes from Romans that
illustrate that and I will take it step by step.


Romans 10:2-4 "I can testify that they have a zeal for G-d, but it is not
enlightened. For being ignorant of the righteousness that comes from G-d
and seeking to establish their own, they have not submitted to G-d's
righteousness. For Christ is the end of the law so that there may be
righteousness for everyone who believes."

Here it shows that the Jews have good intentions "zeal for G-d", and
"ignorant." It shows that they are not disbelieving on purpose, and really
want to worship G-d the best way they can, but are misguided.

Romans 9:31-33: "But Israel, who did strive for the righteousness that is
based on the law, did not succeed in fulfilling the law. Why not? Because
they did not strive for it on the basis of faith, as if it were based on
works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone, as it is written,
'See, I am laying in Zion a stone that will make people stumble, a rock
that will make them fall, and whoever believes in him will not be put to
shame.'"

Now look at that "They have stumbled over a stone." AND then it was G-d who
laid the stone! G-d put the obstacle in front of them.

Romans 11:7-8 "What then? Israel failed to obtain what it was seeking. The
elect obtained it, but the rest were hardened, as it is written.
'G-d gave them a sluggish spirit, eyes that would not see, and ears that
would not hear, down to this very day.;'

Now, not only did G-d lay the stone, but he made it likely for them to trip
over the stone! He blinded the Jews to the truth of Jesus. The Jews who
accepted Christ were the "elect," and the ones who weren't elect were
hardened. It's not that he made the elect smarter, it's that he dumbed down
the rest of the Jews. It is soon explained why this wasn't malicious of
G-d.

Romans 11:11-12: "So I ask, have they stumbled so as to fall? By no means!
But through their stumbling salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to
make Israel jealous. Now if their stumbling means riches for the world, and
if their defeat means riches for the gentiles, how much more were will their
full inclusion mean!"

Right there it says that the Jews have not stumbled to fall. That means,
while the Jews have stumbled, they're not going to hit the ground. Their
stumbling had a purpose, and they will have even more riches than the
gentiles once they are included. This shows that G-d didn't just know that
Jews' rejection would bring the gentiles in, but he planned it that way.

Romans 11:25-29: "So that you may not claim to be wiser than you are,
brothers and sisters, I want you to understand this mystery: a hardening has come upon part of Israel, until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all of Israel will be saved, as is written,
'Out of Zion will come the Deliverer, he will banish ungodliness from
Jacob. And this is my covenant with them, when I take away their sins.''"

So G-d is withholding acceptance of Christ from the Jews until the gentiles
come in first. And then it says that it is part of his covenant with the
Jews. Now did the Lord have a covenant with just the last remaining Jews
during the apocalypse? Or with all the Jews? His covenant was to take away
Israel's sins.

Romans 11:29: "For the gifts and calling of G-d are irrevocable."

This shows G-d is not turning his back on the Jews, that they still will get
their reward.

Romans 11:31-32: "so they have now been disobedient in order that, by the
mercy shown to you, they too may now receive mercy. For G-d has imprisoned all in disobedience so that he may be merciful to all."

The Jews are "imprisoned" in disobedience so that G-d can be merciful. This
illustrates the non accepting Jews as not even really having a choice in the
matter, all so G-d can be merciful to them.

In sum, the Jews were hardened by G-d for to not believe in Christ, as
it was through their disbelief that the gentiles would fully come in. Despite
the hardening, the Jews were still trying to worship G-d as good people,
with a "zeal for G-d" and trying to be righteous. Not arrogance or fear of
changing the religion according to Paul, but "ignorance." This should be
enough for any Christian to agree that if G-d hardened the Jews to not
accept Christ until the gentiles came in, it would be ridiculous for him to
send them to hell for that. But we don't even need to jump to that
conclusion, because besides saying "All of Israel will be saved," it also
says "G-d's gifts (the covenant with Abraham, not the sinaitic one) are
irrevocable" and "For G-d has imprisoned all in disobedience so that he may
be merciful to all." That it is actually G-d's doing that we are
disobedient so he can have mercy with us. Whether you think that applies to
all people or just the Jews, it is undeniably appropriate for the Jews to be
given mercy who were hardened by G-d not to see the light. I'm interested
to hear your thoughts.

MysteryProf

Well, I personally think your explanation of Paul's comments is as good as any, but most Christians I know don't see it that way. A lot of fundamentalists see themselves as the new Israel, and cite verses such as 1 John 2:23: "No one who denies the Son has the Father; everyone who confesses the Son has the Father also."

Actually, 1 Peter uses some stone imagery as well:


My opinion is that Paul's comments are an explanation of the overall failure of the Christians' mission to the Jews. By claiming they refuse to convert as a result of God's will, he acknowledges Christianity's rejection without damaging its credibility. The actual terms for "salvation" get pretty murky, unless you take the fundamentalist hard line, that well-worn fallback, John 14:6: "Jesus said to him: 'I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

Sorry if this post looks like a hodgepodge of random thoughts. I wasn't sure about what you wanted to discuss, so I just posted whatever material came to mind.

Slojodan

MysteryProf,

Your comments are interesting. Keep in mind that all the Jews being saved is not incongruent with the idea that Jesus is needed for salvation. As I said, it could mean that Jews get another chance down the road postmortem too. As for Christians being the new Israel, the context of the "All of Israel will be saved" quote goes against that, since it discusses the covenant with Abraham, and the Jews' worship throughout the surrounding passages. I personally think it's rather brash and arrogant for some Christians to say the Jews aren't Israel anymore. Basically my purpose of that is to show that Jews needn't worry about the threat of hell if the Christians end up being right when all is said and done.