Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Drew J · 10-12-2004, 09:52 AM

Where is it? I can't remember where it is. Help please.

Steven Carr · 10-12-2004, 10:03 AM

Is this the one

2 Thessalonians 3

9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

God seems to be cooperating with Satan here.

Magus55 · 10-12-2004, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Carr

Is this the one

2 Thessalonians 3

9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

God seems to be cooperating with Satan here.

Actually, the verse is referring to the AntiChrist who will deceive the world into thinking he is the Christ, and God will let them fall for it if they have no desire for the truth.

Mageth · 10-12-2004, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magus55

Actually, the verse is referring to the AntiChrist who will deceive the world into thinking he is the Christ, and God will let them fall for it if they have no desire for the truth.

Technically, the verse doesn't indicate they have no desire for "truth". If they had no "desire for truth", they would hardly believe the "lie" bit.

Koyaanisqatsi · 10-12-2004, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Magus55: Actually, the verse is referring to the AntiChrist who will deceive the world into thinking he is the Christ, and God will let them fall for it if they have no desire for the truth.

I desire the truth, yet hold no beliefs in a god or gods, so I couldn't "fall for it" no matter what.

Looks like your little anti-annointed one can only fool the sheep.

And who, by the way, created the anti-annointed one again? All for the purpose of fooling cult members into thinking he is the annointed one? The point of all that utterly ridiculous drama being...what exactly? Eternal damnation for ignorant cult members who are deceived by a supernatural creature whose purpose is to deceive?

And just exactly how are human beings supposed to see through a supernatural being's ability to deceive them? Since they're believers to begin with, it stands to reason (pardon the irony) that they are already asking for their God's direction/clarification, right? So, again I'll ask, the purpose for deceiving cult members is so that they will do more of what they're already doing?

:huh:

Steven Carr · 10-12-2004, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magus55

Actually, the verse is referring to the AntiChrist who will deceive the world into thinking he is the Christ, and God will let them fall for it if they have no desire for the truth.

God lets them fall for what he sends them?

Amlodhi · 10-12-2004, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew J

Where is it? I can't remember where it is. Help please.

Hello Drew J,

The pericope you are looking for is probably:

Quote:

II Corinthians 11:13-15

13. For such are false apostles deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

14. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

15. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Hope that helps,

Amlodhi

Crucifiction · 10-12-2004, 03:38 PM

I absolutely love how Christians twist Bible passages to suggest the existance of one Satanically imbued Anti-Christ.

Fact is, there IS no such creature to be found in the Bible. The one use of the word anti-christ in the Bible {I cannot recall the specific passage} is used to describe people in general that claim to be the Christ. Equally, the whole Book of Revelation is almost certainly a description of what was happening to Christians in Johns day, as opposed to some apocalyptic vision of the future.

DISSIDENT AGGRESSOR · 10-12-2004, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magus55

Actually, the verse is referring to the AntiChrist who will deceive the world into thinking he is the Christ, and God will let them fall for it if they have no desire for the truth.

Which is even a greater reason not to believe what people, who consider themselves as Christian, say, they might not even realise they are actualy working for Mr. Sixhundredsixtysix, deluded by God saying signs and wonders show that the end is nigh :thumbs:

Chili · 10-12-2004, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amlodhi

Quote:

II Corinthians 11:13-15

13. For such are false apostles deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

14. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

15. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Hope that helps,

Amlodhi

Very much so Amlodhi, thank you.

How about the passage where the souls they have saved in the name of God becomes like a trail of filthy rags behind them?

10-12-2004, 09:52 AM	#1
Drew J Banned Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 2,373	Name that verse...satan can manifest as God to fool us Where is it? I can't remember where it is. Help please.

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10-12-2004, 10:03 AM	#2
Steven Carr Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: England Posts: 5,629	Is this the one 2 Thessalonians 3 9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness. God seems to be cooperating with Satan here.

10-12-2004, 03:38 PM	#8
Crucifiction Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: The deformation age Posts: 1,809	I absolutely love how Christians twist Bible passages to suggest the existance of one Satanically imbued Anti-Christ. Fact is, there IS no such creature to be found in the Bible. The one use of the word anti-christ in the Bible {I cannot recall the specific passage} is used to describe people in general that claim to be the Christ. Equally, the whole Book of Revelation is almost certainly a description of what was happening to Christians in Johns day, as opposed to some apocalyptic vision of the future.

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