aa5874

It has been drawn to my attention that many, even some scholars, who are claiming to be HJers are actually MJers.

Once a person believes Jesus was resurrected and cannot account for his actual death then such a person is propagating that Jesus had supernatural abilities.

The belief that Jesus was actually living his AFTERLIFE on earth and was seen EATING fish by his disciples then such a Jesus was a MYTH.

The MJ list may have just increased by about 2 BILLION.

Transient

Well yes except that it is still possible that there is a real god and that said person called "Jesus" was actually "god on earth" - that cannot ever be completely ruled out if one is being honest about this stuff, however unlikely it may seem.

aa5874

Nothing has been ruled out. Just get your DATA, your sources from antiquity, to support your theory.

It is commonly held that nothing is impossible but theories need DATA.

Consider these two possibilities.

1. It is possible that a man found guilty of murder who was executed was actually innocent.

2. It is possible that the man was actually guilty.

A juror does not rule out any possibilty and uses the DATA, witnesses and evidence to come to a conclusion.

Now, a guilty verdict does NOT mean it was impossible for the man to be innocent. A verdict is ONLY based on EVIDENCE.

Consider these two possibilities.

1. It is possible Jesus of the NT did exist.

2. It is possible Jesus of the NT did NOT exist.

I have not ruled out any possibility but have concluded based on non-apologetic DATA, even DATA supplied by the NT and Church writers that Jesus of the NT was a MYTH.

Now, please identify the non-apologetic DATA from antiquity that supportS the possibility that Jesus of the NT did exist.

Never ever forget that it is NOT impossible that Jesus of the NT did NOT EXIST.

Transient

I do not disagree but merely point out that when dealing with stuff like this one can be wrong even tho the evidence appeared to support one's theory.
It is my current opinion that religions of all types have been largely used to control the masses for whatever reasons. None of the ancient writers would be writing with the thought that we today would be analyzing their writings in minute detail. They would have been writing merely to control current problems in their own lifetimes.
Whether there is a god who created everything is beyond my ability to know to any degree of certainty and seems to me at the moment to be quite unlikely that the character portrayed in the bible as "god" is consistent enuf to be believable.

Doug Shaver

Do you think that for any proposition P, "P cannot ever be completely ruled out, however unlikely it may seem" tells us anything at all about the reasonableness of believing P?

Transient

ah yes but then we get into the complicated group of thoughts associated with wishing, hoping, belief and faith - so intertwined and so little understood by believers and non-believers alike.
It seems to me that a lot of christian belief is based on wishing and hoping which sort of starts getting converted to what people call faith and belief, often based on almost nothing at all, ie very little foundation for the buildings, just lovely walls and roof. While all the social activities of a church are running along smoothly people have little time or inclination to check the foundations.