Freethought & Rationalism Archive

User · 09-09-2003, 08:48 PM

Is there any evidence in the Bible for a place of torment where non-believers are condemned to for eternity. I've heard no from some people, yes from others.

Biblical scholars...what's the final word?

Godless Wonder · 09-09-2003, 09:39 PM

Disclaimer: I'm no bible scholar, by any stretch.

Here is talk of eternal damnation.

Quote:

Mark 003:029 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation.

Here is another way to be damned:

Quote:

Mark 016:016 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

And what is damnation? This quote links damnation with hell (though not necessarily equating the two).

Quote:

Matthew 23:033 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

Quote:

Thessalonians 001:008 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Thessalonians 001:009 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Some more stuff from Mark

Quote:

Mark:009:043 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:

Mark:009:044 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Mark:009:045 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:

Mark:009:046 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Mark:009:047 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:

Mark:009:048 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Mark:009:049 For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.

Make of it all what you will.

judge · 09-09-2003, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by User
Is there any evidence in the Bible for a place of torment where non-believers are condemned to for eternity. I've heard no from some people, yes from others.

Biblical scholars...what's the final word?

I could perhaps nitpick some things in this link but it probably goes some way towrds explaining why the matter is one where even beleivers disagree.

Happy to try to deal with additional questions

http://www.preteristarchive.com/Part...uel_pp_02.html

Magus55 · 09-10-2003, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by User
Is there any evidence in the Bible for a place of torment where non-believers are condemned to for eternity. I've heard no from some people, yes from others.

Biblical scholars...what's the final word?

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

User · 09-10-2003, 05:50 PM

Great link judge! All I needed to know.

Magus55 · 09-10-2003, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by User
Great link judge! All I needed to know.

You might want to investigate further than that link. Preterism is very very questionable. Purgatory is a Catholic invention, not Hell. As the verses i posted show, Hell is quite Biblical. Even Jesus talked ALOT about it.

Zucco · 09-11-2003, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
As the verses i posted show, Hell is quite Biblical. Even Jesus talked ALOT about it.

Yep, Jesus is love. I sit with my kids every night and discuss how I'm going to toss them in a bonfire unless they do exactly as I say.

Magus55 · 09-11-2003, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zucco
Yep, Jesus is love. I sit with my kids every night and discuss how I'm going to toss them in a bonfire unless they do exactly as I say.

If Jesus wasn't love, He wouldn't have died so you could live. Why is this such a hard concept? Jesus, perfectly innocent and sinless, chose to give up His mortal life so you could avoid righteous punishment. If you spend your entire life rejecting God, laughing at Him, etc., and you end up in Hell for your sins, you will have NO ONE to blame but yourself. Its your own stupid fault for being so arrogant and thinking God can't possibly exist, because humans can explain everything. When you stand before God at judgement, you will have not one single excuse for why you chose to reject Him. Your life in minute detail will be laid out, and everything you did wrong will be shown to you; even things you don't know about.

Zucco · 09-11-2003, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Its your own stupid fault for being so arrogant and thinking God can't possibly exist, because humans can explain everything.

No, it's the Christian god's fault for allowing there to be so much confusion about his existence. He can't even unite his own believers , much less the rest of the world. The great majority of the human population doesn't believe in the Christian god. With eternal agony as the punishment for non-believers, why can't he do a better job proving his existence? Indeed, why can't he do anything at all to prove his existence?

User · 09-11-2003, 01:38 PM

All true stuff Zucco.

Magus there is nothing ethical about the Hell/Heaven system.

09-09-2003, 08:48 PM	#1
User Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: All of Tomorrow's Parties Posts: 328	H-E-Double Hockey Sticks!!! Is there any evidence in the Bible for a place of torment where non-believers are condemned to for eternity. I've heard no from some people, yes from others. Biblical scholars...what's the final word?

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09-10-2003, 05:50 PM	#5
User Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: All of Tomorrow's Parties Posts: 328	Great link judge! All I needed to know.

09-11-2003, 01:38 PM	#10
User Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: All of Tomorrow's Parties Posts: 328	All true stuff Zucco. Magus there is nothing ethical about the Hell/Heaven system.

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