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Old 12-08-2005, 03:20 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orthodox_Freethinker
Yes. What Jesus asserted is that those who accuse His miracles of being the product of Satan have blasphemed against the Holy Spirit and will not be forgiven either in this world nor the world to come. However, this does not rule out an intermediate state in which blasphemers against the Holy Spirit can be forgiven.
By who's rules will they not be forgiven? Which of the three faces of god made up this rule and how the hell could anyone know the difference between the actions of the holy ghost or some "product of Satan?" Does being unforgiven result in God's love suddenly becoming painful? Your worldview has some serious flaws, your all-loving god-is-love god seems to make up arbitrary rules and seems enjoy eternally tormenting people with his presence without cause or purpose.
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Old 12-08-2005, 03:27 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orthodox_Freethinker
Yes. What Jesus asserted is that those who accuse His miracles of being the product of Satan have blasphemed against the Holy Spirit and will not be forgiven either in this world nor the world to come. However, this does not rule out an intermediate state in which blasphemers against the Holy Spirit can be forgiven.
I call bullshit.

In Matthew and Mark, yes, Jesus is talking to the Pharisees who claimed his miracles came from Beelzebub. In Luke, the comments are not in that context. But in all three gospels, Jesus does not limit his comments.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 12
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. 32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark 3
29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke 12
10 But unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven
I still remember being scared shitless by this when I was a kid. My friend said something along the lines of "fuck the holy spirit" (why she said this I don't recall, but she always liked to shock people). I looked at her like she was already dead. I mean, that was it. No redemption, no forgiveness, no parole. It really freaked me out.
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Old 12-08-2005, 04:19 PM   #33
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Holy Spirit is a fancy way of saying "voices in your head"
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Old 12-09-2005, 03:00 AM   #34
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John –
Quote:
You must have missed this earlier post…
No sir, I have simply been enjoying a contented sleep. I wouldn’t even dream of missing one of your enlightening posts!
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Can you point out some of the many other things that the Holy Spirit is?
He is the christian's: comforter; guide; and helper.

I.C Unicorns -
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"voices in your head"
Or in your heart and soul?
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Old 12-09-2005, 11:34 AM   #35
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Or in your heart and soul?
What makes you think you have a soul?
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Old 12-09-2005, 11:44 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Helpmabob
John – No sir, I have simply been enjoying a contented sleep. I wouldn’t even dream of missing one of your enlightening posts! He is the christian's: comforter; guide; and helper.
I thought guardian angels were supposed to do this.

In any event, since god is all-powerful why can't he do it directly without all this intervention?

Thanks.
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Old 12-09-2005, 02:43 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Helpmabob
I.C Unicorns - Or in your heart and soul?
If I have voices in my heart, get me to a physician!
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Old 12-10-2005, 02:21 AM   #38
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Hi John -
Quote:
I thought guardian angels were supposed to do this [comfort, guide and help].
Interesting, why do you say this, please? I think they may have brought protection at times e.g. in the case of Shardach, Meshach and Abednigo in the furnace.
Quote:
In any event, since god is all-powerful why can't he do it directly without all this intervention?
I can't give a perfect answer to this qusetion, as man cannot know the mind of God. You could think of it as the Holy Spirit being a manifestation of God, and therefore his power, on earth.

Hi I.C Unicorns - Do you consider yourself to have a conscience?
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Old 12-10-2005, 10:13 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steamer
If god insists on punishing me with his presence when he knows it is torment and there is no purpose to it then god his son and the holy spook are all buttheads. This god is indistinguishable from any other evil dictator. Of course all dictators are loved by their buttkissing inner-circle. Call yourself a freethinker all you like, shit is not shinola and this god is not less evil than one that would torment your children in hell for the huge crime of mere disbelief.
This had to be the most enlightened and intelligent treatise I have ever read on a message board! Clearly the product of tireless decades of intense theological study at the world's most acclaimed seminary colleges. Come to think of it, it stands at the apex of the greatest intellectual achievement of modern philosophical thought. Albert Einstein's "On the electrodynamics of moving bodies" cannot touch this thing. Steamer most certainly deserves the Nobel Prize for this work. And if he doesn't get the Nobel Prize then at least the religious community is in a state of 'shock and awe' after having read this brilliant exhibition of modern Atheist thought. On behalf of Christians everywhere, thanks for letting us know where you brilliant geniuses stand!
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Old 12-10-2005, 10:36 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helpmabob
I can't give a perfect answer to this qusetion, as man cannot know the mind of God. You could think of it as the Holy Spirit being a manifestation of God, and therefore his power, on earth.
Several churches in Europe have feathers from the Holy Ghost. Does that help your dicussion of the HG's functions in any way?

I don't really expect perfect answers to any of my questions. So the HG is simply a "manifestation" of god.

Interesting!
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