Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Ryzo · 12-04-2005, 07:46 PM

Seriousuly, what is the holy spirit and what are its functions? I know that the Father is supposed to be the angry all powerful guy that smites people and damns them to hell. I know that Jesus is the dude who begs the Father not to damn everyone and died for our sins. Where does the holy spirit fit into this?

Celine · 12-04-2005, 07:49 PM

I need semantical help with this, too. And theological. And empirical.

I don't figure to receive the latter, but I'm always hopeful.
I'll wait along with you, Scyld

Joan of Bark · 12-04-2005, 09:49 PM

I think for Christians it's like pornography: they know what it is when they see it.

Ryzo · 12-07-2005, 06:25 PM

Bump.

Could someone please anwser this?

Nice Squirrel · 12-07-2005, 06:33 PM

It a secret. You have to be in the inner circle.

Toto · 12-07-2005, 06:41 PM

Catholic Doctrine on the HS

Quote:

The doctrine of the Catholic Church concerning the Holy Ghost forms an integral part of her teaching on the mystery of the Holy Trinity, of which St. Augustine (De Trin., I, iii, 5), speaking with diffidence, says: "In no other subject is the danger of erring so great, or the progress so difficult, or the fruit of a careful study so appreciable". The essential points of the dogma may be resumed in the following propositions:

The Holy Ghost is the Third Person of the Blessed Trinity.

Though really distinct, as a Person, from the Father and the Son, He is consubstantial with Them; being God like Them, He possesses with Them one and the same Divine Essence or Nature.

He proceeds, not by way of generation, but by way of spiration, from the Father and the Son together, as from a single principle.

Such is the belief the Catholic faith demands.

Your idea that the Father is angy and vengeful and the Son pleads for forgiveness would be rank heresy to the Catholic Church. They are of the same substance.

Wikipedia

Quote:

Christians believe it is the Holy Spirit who leads people to faith in Jesus and the one who gives them the ability to lead a Christian life. The Spirit dwells inside every true Christian, each one's body being His temple (First Epistle to the Corinthians 3:16). He is depicted as a 'Counsellor' or 'Helper' (paracletus in Latin, derived from Greek), guiding them in the way of the truth. The Spirit's action in one's life is believed to produce positive results, known as the Fruit of the Spirit. The Spirit is also believed to give gifts (i.e. abilities) to Christians. These may include the charismatic gifts such as prophecy, tongues, healing, and knowledge.

Critique of Wm Lane Craig's theory of the Holy Spirit

You will also find the HS described as a figment of the Christian imagination.

Clivedurdle · 12-08-2005, 01:46 AM

May I recommend the specialists? Assemblies of God!

http://www.ag.org/top/beliefs/truths.cfm#7

Just glancing at the site I couldn't quickly see a brief definition, but the point is that the Holy Ghost is the comforter, the presense of God with us now in our lives, so this would be assumed because the evidence of xianity is the indwelling of the Holy Ghost and the gifts and fruits.

It is powerful stuff this - seriously the best whiskies!

(Double check - Jesus is Immanuel!)

WishboneDawn · 12-08-2005, 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joan of Bark

I think for Christians it's like pornography: they know what it is when they see it.

OIr we take for granted that you secular folk can Google?

WishboneDawn · 12-08-2005, 04:04 AM

From religious tolerence.org...

Quote:

The Christian belief that deity is simultaneously a unity and is composed of three persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. As the ancient Athanasian Creed is worded, the Trinity is "one God" and "three persons... and yet they are not three Gods, but one God." Extensive debate about the nature of God and of Jesus occurred during the early centuries of the Church until this concept was forced on the church by Constantine.

God by committee in my mind. I think it's, at it's core, an attempt to reconcile different ideas of God and Jesus and to build a framework for ordinary people to understand and worship God. The history and politics in those centuries when they were first attempting to hammer this out (not that it's settled today) are good, juicy reading.

Helpmabob · 12-08-2005, 07:59 AM

The Holy Spirit is many things, as mentioned above, but additionally it is a guarantee to a christian that he / she will be redeemed: And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. [Ephesians 4:30]

12-04-2005, 07:46 PM	#1
Ryzo Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: U.S., N.C Posts: 465	What is the holy spirit? Seriousuly, what is the holy spirit and what are its functions? I know that the Father is supposed to be the angry all powerful guy that smites people and damns them to hell. I know that Jesus is the dude who begs the Father not to damn everyone and died for our sins. Where does the holy spirit fit into this?

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12-04-2005, 07:49 PM	#2
Celine Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Ames, IA Posts: 543	I need semantical help with this, too. And theological. And empirical. I don't figure to receive the latter, but I'm always hopeful. I'll wait along with you, Scyld

12-04-2005, 09:49 PM	#3
Joan of Bark Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Pua, in northern Thailand Posts: 2,823	I think for Christians it's like pornography: they know what it is when they see it.

12-07-2005, 06:25 PM	#4
Ryzo Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: U.S., N.C Posts: 465	Bump. Could someone please anwser this?

12-07-2005, 06:33 PM	#5
Nice Squirrel Contributor Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Death Panel District 9 Posts: 20,921	It a secret. You have to be in the inner circle.

12-08-2005, 01:46 AM	#7
Clivedurdle Contributor Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: London UK Posts: 16,024	May I recommend the specialists? Assemblies of God! http://www.ag.org/top/beliefs/truths.cfm#7 Just glancing at the site I couldn't quickly see a brief definition, but the point is that the Holy Ghost is the comforter, the presense of God with us now in our lives, so this would be assumed because the evidence of xianity is the indwelling of the Holy Ghost and the gifts and fruits. It is powerful stuff this - seriously the best whiskies! (Double check - Jesus is Immanuel!)

12-08-2005, 07:59 AM	#10
Helpmabob Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: UK Posts: 431	The Holy Spirit is many things, as mentioned above, but additionally it is a guarantee to a christian that he / she will be redeemed: And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. [Ephesians 4:30]

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