Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Grizzly · 01-09-2006, 04:02 PM

Hello all,

I'm currently in a discussion on another board with someone who believes that Matthew 27:51-53 is not describing actual events, but was meant to be symbolic (although most everything else is literal, according to him). Heres the passage in question.

And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

My question to you learned scholars is this - are you aware of any biblical scholar that argues that this passage was not meant to be a description of an actual event?

Thanks

hatsoff · 01-09-2006, 04:08 PM

I can't see any reason to suppose it's figurative. Why don't you quote some of his explanation for us, so that we have something more specific to respond to. Also, be sure to let him know you're copying his posts in this forum (to avoid being rude).

Grizzly · 01-09-2006, 04:29 PM

I'm afraid that the discussion we are having is not very scholarly. Here's his response to the third time I asked for clarification.

Quote:

I've answered this twice for you now.

For the third time, it's not referring to a literal, physical resurrection. The Bible tells us that this will come later.

It is refering to Christ's redemptive work on the cross on behalf of the faithful Jews, who were saved by keeping the law, but who's salvation was now fulfilled in Christ.

Notice that it is tied to the renting of the Temple veil. This is symbolic of the victory of Christ's death over law.

These faithful Jews were saved by the law, but now the law has been fullfilled in Christ, so they are no longer waiting in Abraham's Bosom, but now go to be with the Father.

I got into an argument with him before about the greek word genea in Matthew 24:34. Most people interpret it as "generation", a few others interpret it as "race". He claimed it meant "creation". I couldn't find anyone who had interpreted it that way.

Anyway, any info about this would be appreciated.

hatsoff · 01-10-2006, 05:20 AM

The Bible does indeed tell us that men will be saved (resurrected) later on, at Christ's second coming. However, that prophesy is neither mentioned nor symbolized by Matthew 27, as far as I can tell. It seems to be a simple straight-forward telling of Jesus' death.

Julian · 01-10-2006, 06:53 AM

The tearing of the veil is a symbolic line against the Jewish religion, including the laws, probably. The issue at hand is which veil was rent as they had several, I believe Josephus talks about them. However, an event could have really happened and still possess symbolism. Like most everything else in the gospels we have absolutely no evidence to tell us if it really happened, however, due to the strongly symbolic nature of the section, it can be surmised that it is merely a polemical invention by the evangelist.

Julian

01-09-2006, 04:02 PM	#1
Grizzly Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 2,936	Matthew 27:51-53. Was it meant to be figurative? Hello all, I'm currently in a discussion on another board with someone who believes that Matthew 27:51-53 is not describing actual events, but was meant to be symbolic (although most everything else is literal, according to him). Heres the passage in question. And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many. My question to you learned scholars is this - are you aware of any biblical scholar that argues that this passage was not meant to be a description of an actual event? Thanks

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01-09-2006, 04:08 PM	#2
hatsoff Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Rockford, IL Posts: 740	I can't see any reason to suppose it's figurative. Why don't you quote some of his explanation for us, so that we have something more specific to respond to. Also, be sure to let him know you're copying his posts in this forum (to avoid being rude).

01-10-2006, 05:20 AM	#4
hatsoff Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Rockford, IL Posts: 740	The Bible does indeed tell us that men will be saved (resurrected) later on, at Christ's second coming. However, that prophesy is neither mentioned nor symbolized by Matthew 27, as far as I can tell. It seems to be a simple straight-forward telling of Jesus' death.

01-10-2006, 06:53 AM	#5
Julian Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Washington, DC (formerly Denmark) Posts: 3,789	The tearing of the veil is a symbolic line against the Jewish religion, including the laws, probably. The issue at hand is which veil was rent as they had several, I believe Josephus talks about them. However, an event could have really happened and still possess symbolism. Like most everything else in the gospels we have absolutely no evidence to tell us if it really happened, however, due to the strongly symbolic nature of the section, it can be surmised that it is merely a polemical invention by the evangelist. Julian

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