Alf

Ok, So god has this wonderful wisdom as to how we should live together in peace and harmony but he hides it away so that he can watch us fight and kill and mame a bit more?

Why does that sound more like an ad hoc explanation to me?

Why do I feel that this god is not worthy of worship?

Oh, I guess mankind will progress and we will evolve. Both as individuals and as society. However, I never sense that any of our evolution has been caused by any sky daddy. In fact, the ten commandments only contained a summary of wisdom of the day. Jesus' sayings contained also a more or less (in)complete summary of the wisdom of his day partly based on eastern influence where from they most certainly got the golden rule where it had been taught for centuries.

Since NT was written society has evolved and the church has changed with it - even if screaming and kicking. We got concepts like tolerance, the idea that discrimination is bad etc. The church was originally against many such ideas but they have followed suit and today they talk about these things as "christian values". Yet, again it was MAN's idea - not their fantasy god's idea.

The geneva convention, the human rights etc etc etc - all the good moral values we have attained in modern times has been man's achievement. God has played no part. Also, looking back, Jesus sayings was just plain wisdom of the day of his time, he said nothing new - again his sayings was man's sayings - not from God - unless God happen to always stay in tune with man, which appear quite useless if you ask me. Also, going back to Moses' time, the ten commandments and the whole "law" contained the general wisdom of the day, their neighbouring tribes followed more or less the same rules. If you assert the ten commandments etc was divine origin you somehow have to assert that while all the peoples in that region exchanged moral ideas and values they somehow left the jews out and never told them anything until Yahweh told the jews exactly what their neighbours had known for a long time already.

I see no reason to credit a fantasy invisible sky daddy with somethi9ng which is so obviously of human origin.

Alf

Professor

Needed to? What a strange thing to say. Exactly who is setting down these rules which Yahve "needs to" follow?

An omnipotent being should be able to accomplish any goal with a thought rather than "have to" initiate a gruesome human sacrifice. Or It could have set the price to be a really good basket of blueberry muffins rather than a bloody corpse. Yeshua could have been the chef who baked for our sins. That would have been a much better arrangement for all concerned.

Of course, from the very beginning (Cain and Abel) the OT makes it clear that Yahve really gets off on the smell of blood ("Yummm. It is a sweet savour unto Yahve.") but doesn't care much for baked goods. What a perv. At least I can understand Zeus' attraction to women.

And if Yeshau did pay the price to eliminate original sin, how come the punishments (working the soil, pain in childbirth, etc.) are still in effect? I think we should demand a refund on this purchase.

Hey Yeshua, do you still have the receipt?

Chili

One of the best kept secrets in the world is that we are in charge of God until we become God and then we are just in charge of ourselves. Until then we must at least pretend that we have free will and I think that the message here is that Jesus, at this time in life, was both human and God and now had to get his ego crucified by the same people that shaped it.I don't think you know what omnipotent means. Your coffee shop version reeks with the foul smell of ignorance.He did in his life and showed you how to do it in your life . . . and it is as easy as eating and drinking and better than blueberry muffins ever will be for their goodness are also an exctaction of our richess in heaven (or are you trying to tell me that 'taste' is not a reflection of these richess just as pain is a reflection of their absense).