Kamikaze_Badger

From Religious Tolerance.org on the subject of things Jesus did that could be considered sinful:


Source



So, was Jesus too good to be labled as a sinner or something?

Boro Nut

J Christ
"Suffer the little children to come onto me"

G Glitter
"Would you like to see some puppies?"

M Jackson
"Or a chimpanzee?"

Boro Nut

Toto

Perhaps this is a good reason to consider whether there is any historical basis for any of the alleged sins. If not, then you are missing the point.

For example, driving the moneychangers out of the Temple involved violence, destruction of property, and interference in commerce. But it almost certainly didn't happen. It is a symbolic act representing the ritual clensing of a holy place, based on the Hebrew Scriptures.

Jesus certainly did not drive demons out of a possessed man (because there are no demons), much less send them into innocent farm animals that then committed suicide like a herd of lemmings.

Chris Weimer

By that analysis, Toto, then the resurrection was just a metaphor for the task of all of us having to kill our old selves to be reborn with a new found knowledge, aka gnosis, symbolized by the tongue of the Holy Ghost. In other words, it's Chili's disgression on the bible. I, for one, actually now endorses that sort of thought, if it means dispelling fundamentalism.

TightSight

This is something that i have been wondering about, and i don't think it has been mentioned (atleast in this discussion) thusfar. In John 7:1-10 Jesus seems to clearly lie to his disciples when he says that he isn't going to go to the feast. I'm guessing that lying is a fairly blatant sin so there has to be that I am interpreting this wrong or something. Does anyone know what the original greek says?

Johnny Scholar

jesus was also wrong when he said that some of the people present there would still be alive when he returned. didn't happen.

Chris Weimer

wasn't there a whole debate on that? http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=91354

Toto

I was always under the impression that the Virgin birth was a part of Jesus being without sin. Because of the Fall, Adam and Eve passed sin along to all of their descendents; Jesus only escaped this fate by being born without the contamination of sexual intercourse. But I think that was later church doctrine.

The Biblical source for saying that Jesus was without sin:

Hebrews 4:14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are--yet was without sin.

The "sinlessness" related to the necessity of the sacrificial animal to be free of blemishes. But Hebrews has little or nothing to do with the gospels.

I think that the Jesus character in the gospels had to have some qualities that added to the narrative, so there would be some plot elements, some drama, some tension.

Sheshbazzar

His alleged conduct was open rebellion against the Law, and contrary to the commandments given in Deut. 17:8-12 and 21:5
This law was specifically instituted to deal with rebellion, and ostensibly was the express commandment of Yahweh, given without exception, and without recourse to any other authority.
IF he refused to submit to the decrees and decisions of the legally authorized priesthood, He was guilty of transgressing the law, and was in sin, "for sin is the transgression of the law."

While the N.T. may be full of fabrications, there is little to doubt that the Jewish people living in Jerusalem at the time of these alleged events had the teachings of the Torah, and a 'Divinely' authorized Priesthood to whom was vested the final and ultimate authority in all matters of interpretation and conduct.
Judaism has used this god given authority to interpret, to nullify certain commandments, and even to completely reverse others.
Christianity likes to pretend that 'Christ was the end of the Law', however even by their teaching, the Law was in effect until his death. Thus he, prior to his death, would also need submit to its dictates or be found a transgressor.

Jehanne

It's the "dogma" of the Immaculate Conception (within Roman Catholicism at least) that Mary was conceived without original sin. Had she had original sin she would have "passed" it on to Baby Jesus. I suppose that the modern-day equivalent would be herpes. :rolling: