Chili

Hi Asimis, that connection sure exists and the eternal light only exists outside of time. For the sake of discussion I would say that our time of day is an illusion just as the light of common day is an illusion, which is not to say that time 'is not' or eternal life could not be real. Both time and light pre-exist in us, with the "Thousand Year Reign" being the duration of time wherein we can be eternal, and the knowledge accumulated during that time (by our ancestors) being the wisdom that we can be illuminated by (either as 'like god' prior to illumination and fully God after illumination).

Note that we are incarnate beings with the potential to become God and also that the Thousand Year Reign[of God] already is within us.

According to Catholic theology our loss of appreciation for the light of common day is symbolized with the period of Advent that must precede the Christ-mass wherein we are (or can be) born into eternal life. This would be where the sun stopped for the first time. In this context can we say that eternal life begins here but we are not fully exposed to the celestial light of which we saw a glimpse in the Beatific Vision wherein Christ was born (some claim to have seen the light or a similar light such as with some NDE's; I add NDE's to show some non-religious support for this light). From here we go to Purgatory and no longer to church except to provoke the pharisees from the precinct that we may be crucified by them (according to the Gospels).

In Purgatory we must separate the light from darkness to the point that we no longer have any faith and are beyond theology to make the sun stop for the second time (as opposed to beyond desire when the sun stopped the first time). This would be Easter when we have finally emptied our conscious mind and can rejoice with our eidetic images fully recalled in our subconscious mind.

So to answer your question, I would say that the sun stops for the second time to those who are outside of time once they have completed the race = heaven = fully God instead of 'like god.'

John A. Broussard

What in the world does this have to do with Joshua stopping the sun?

Evoken

Nothing, I was just trying to understand where Chili was coming from.

Ruy Lopez

Like I said earlier, Chili derailed his own topic on the first post to discuss his favorite brand of casuistry. I was attracted by the title of the thread but was soon disappointed by the lack of substance and the derailment.

Chili, I feel a bit sorry for being blunt and not playing according to your lead. I should have just stayed out. In our private Yahoogroup for my university classmates, we have someone like you, almost exactly like you. We treat him with courtesy because he is our old friend. He wants to play the role of spiritual guru for the group.

It is very difficult to discuss Chili's belief framework (and I accept that Chili is serious) because it cannot be pinned down to specifics. He has constructed for himself what gives him inner peace. The belief system "borrows from" or has similarities to Gnostic Christianity, Buddhism, and the so-called New Age as promoted by Chopra or Neil Walsh.

Someone arguing from this belief stance can weave out of a difficulty simply by altering the topic or introducing new elements that can't be proven or disproven outright but one that we know to be untrue like "saints in heaven".

It's up to the reader to engage Chili in his home turf. It's a good discussion if one feels and thinks similarly as Chili.

Chili

Thanks for stopping in Ruy and please know that I did not mean to offend you by explaining what is meant by the sun stopped. It is just an opinion in the form of an argument that was made in response to a question on the board.

Thanks again and see you around.

Awmte

Legends would be more the realm of the mythmaker, not history. And the Bible would not qualify as an historical treatise.
Are we talking about the "Light of God" or are we discussing the (putative) halting of the sun's motion across the sky? I'm starting to get a wee bit confused here.

Ruy Lopez

Am with you there.

I hope I'm not misrepresenting Chili; but to understand what he is saying, one needs some background in ancient gnosticism, modern new age philosophy, and Hindu/Buddhist philosophy.

Note that Chili said that natural sunlight or the time of day are illusions:
I highlighted pre-exist.

Compare Chili's statements with what my university classmate decades ago writes at present:
emphasis mine.

Pre-exist relates directly to "remembering who we really are". And this classmate of mine also loves to write in poetry form like Chili. Observe:

Both Chili and my classmate even assert that intellectual knowledge is inadequate and inferior to "real knowledge" once we remember who we are. The message here is that all of us are also Divine but are unaware. As we become more and more "divine" or enlightened (Buddhism), we would regard earthly life and experiences as illusions because they are nothing compared to an eternal perspective.

Got it now? Of course, I don't buy this philosophy. I have never seen it at work.

Ruy

Chili

We are talking about the sun but not the physical movement of the sun. Just the inability of Joshua to transform sunrays into light with his eyes wide open in broad daylight. In my argument I am not trying to testify to the absense of this light but just to the function of the mind as interpreter of sunrays into light. You may have heard expressions such as "the grass looked greener
after my eyes were opened" (or whatever) and this would be a varaint of such an experience but in the other direction.

No, it is not history but if Joshua tells us that it happened to him there is no reason not to accept that in the way I describe the event. Lets face it, if the grass can look greener on a happy day it can look darker on a sad day and here it never turned green at all.

Chili

You are quite right. I would argue the same:

mirror mirror on the wall, who is the fairest of us all?

or Joyce midstream in his Beatific Vision on page 171 "Portrait" (Penguin; near the end of chapter 4).

". . . : and girlish, and touched with the wonder of mortal beauty, her face."

Here's one of the most lovely lines by Joyce:

"You know what Ireland is? asked Stephen with cold violence. Ireland is the old sow that eats her farrow." = Catholicism eating its own afterbirth.

Or Zamjatin in "WE", "poetry is a commodity" and the bible, "for thirty silver pieces they purchased the field of blood."

And especially for you where Joyce ends the countdown of 40 days on April 27, just 3 days before he went "underground" to rise again on May 1. It signifies heaven on earth for Joyce with his last line "Old father, old artificer, stand me now and ever in good stead." = father into thy hands I commit my spirit.

braces_for_impact

I like cheese. Some cheese is yellow. Daylight is yellow, therefore daylight is really just an expression of god's love for cheese. It is merely an illusion though, because we all know that when darkness descends on the world, it is not nothingness, but simply a lack of cheese; of god's love, if you will.

If you don't believe me look up [Insert random non-sequitur bible quote here].

I like cheese.