Spanish_Inquisitor

I was looking at a sales flyer from the Teaching Company and there was an excerpt from one of the lectures entitled "Do we have the original New Testament?" The course is given by a Professor Bart Ehrman at the UNC at Chapel Hill.

I was amazed to find that we do not have any originals of the NT, and in fact, we only have copies of copies of copies, etc. These copies often have many mistakes that are repeated through subsequent copies.

He mentioned in the excerpt that the famous story in John of the woman who was caught in the act of adultery, where Jesus says "let the one without sin cast the first stone", was not in the original, and in fact did not show up in copies of the NT until the Middle of the 12th century, and it was this copy that was used in the translation of the KJV, which is why it is now in the English versions we are familiar with.

I'm sure you all knew this, but when I learn something knew, I like to share it. :wave:

SI

dancer_rnb

Most people wouldn't be able to read an original copy of the New Testament.

Steven Avery

Hi Spanish.. Wow.. Bart has the original ? He can be a very rich man.
So, when Augustine discussed why it dropped out of some manuscripts around 400 AD, was he working with a time machine, or what ? How about Jerome quoting the verse, and placing it in the Vulgate (400 A.D.), what was he, chopped liver ? Or all the Latin manuscripts. And actually there were lots of Greek mansuscripts before then. Are you sure you are not conflating Ehrman's misinformation on the Pericope with his misinformation on the Johannine Comma ? Please take a look. Hmmm.. if this is an accurate report, even for the Comma, maybe Bart better go back to remedial textual history school. Or take the middle name of Simpson.
Well at least you don't have anything invested in Bart's book. Tis a good lesson. Caveat emptor.

Shalom,
Praxeas
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/

Haran

It is amazing that we have many copies that date before the fourth century at all when one considers the pagan emperor Diocletian's efforts to wipe out Christian literature (as mentioned in multiple sources on textual criticism).

darstec

You are assuming the Jerome's Latin Vulgate got to us unscathed by well meaning Christians. Hint: It didn't. It was altered as late as the 17th century.

gregor2

prax

Please let us know when you'll be posting your CV and list of publications, and please come over to the EvC room and post your YEC nonsense.

Casper

Spanish,

your question is often asked but seldom is the real question that you want an answer for.

Step out of your paradigm for a moment and walk into a bookstore; check out what versions are available. Such an array does not necessarily mean that there ever was an "original".

John A. Broussard

It's extraordinary how you can misquote and mis-characterize. What was there in the OP that even remotely suggested that Bart has the original?

Spanish_Inquisitor

Hi praxeus. Actually, John B is correct. I didn't think I even implied that Professor Ehrman (you call him Bart...do you know him personally?) has the original. In fact, to the contrary, I though it was clear that the original does not exist, and that the only extant copies are many generations removed from the original. Sorry if I confused you.

It's not a book, it's a series of lectures he recorded for the Teaching Co. And I really have no idea how true what he said in the excerpt is, since I have no real knowledge of the history of the Bible. Actually, it's one of the reasons why I was attracted to the excerpt and read it, because I don't know, and one of the reasons I threw it out here was to see if it was true. I'm very much impressed with the level of knowledge on this board, and figured that between all of you, the truth will sort out.

I listened to two (free) lectures of his in the past, and he seems to know what he's talking about. One was about the discovery of the gnostic gospels at Nag Hammadi, and the other was a discussion about some of the facts behind the Da Vinci Code (apparently there were not many). I was impressed, but then as a layman, that would not be hard to do to me. Is anyone else familiar with Professor Ehrman, and his credentials? The Teaching Co has his short CV here . I don't get the impression he comes from an atheistic background.

So is what he says true, or have some basis in truth?

SI

John A. Broussard

The subject is extremely complex. I suggest you go to the forum at http://neonostalgia.com/forum/ where there are numerous threads dealing with the subject.

Be prepared, however. Many of the people posting at that site are experts in their fields, but they'll be happy to explain if you're willing to listen.