JPD

The writer is evidently trying to impress upon the reader that there is an either/or choice and that one must be chosen. This is false. I can believe that Jesus existed and have no particular view on how he was as a person but I reject the extravagant claims made about him by others. But in any case the Bible holds the family to be important yet has no qualms about driving divides between family members. If God is internally contradictory then it may be that the Bible is not but as this is impossible to determine it cannot be said one way or the other whether the contradiction is actual or not. But in any case, I do not believe for a split second that anything at all can be said about something that nothing is known about, which for all intents and purposes does not exist. It is easy to make wild claims about something that cannot be verified and validated but it takes a fool to believe that it represents evidence.

John A. Broussard

Thanks, but you still haven't told me how you tell biblical commands from biblical guidelines.

What rule(s) do you follow?

arricchio

Since no one has yet brought it up, I thought I'd throw this out: I think the passages most Christians like to ignore are all the ones supporting slavery.

The Bible is clearly pro-slavery. If every word of the Bible is true, then we committed a sin by ratifying the 13th Amendment.

Gen 27:13,23,27 - God ordered Abraham to circumcise those of his bondservants bought with money and those born in his household as sign of his faith in God. So, it's okay to buy slaves and even breed them, as long as they are circumcised. Besides, why would God order Abraham to go cutting on his slaves' penises as a show of faith, if God thought slavery was wrong?

Gen 20:14; 12:14; 24:14 - Mentions that the patriarchs, including Abraham - the man God chose because of his extreme righteous - all owned slaves. If slavery is wrong, isn't God wrong for giving special favoritism to slaveowners? God is never wrong, so slavery must be right, according to scripture.

Lev 25:19 - shows that there is a difference between hired-servants and bond servants. Hired servants are to be treated better. Therefore, the lowly status of the slave is justified in God's holy law. Verses 44-46 says that those whose who are forcibly made slaves are to remain slaves forever God said it, so that settles it - there can be no freeing of slaves, if you believe the Bible.

Ex 21:20,21, 26,27,29-32 - Sets out different penalties for injuries inflicted on freeman, slaves, and cattle. If slavery is evil, then why would God take the trouble to set down laws governing its practice? Why did he not just outlaw it? He had Moses and the stone tablets right there. He could have done it, but apparently chose not to.

In the New Testament there are numerous instances were the apostles encourage slaves to obey thier masters without complaint: Col 3:22; 1Tim 6-16; 1 Peter 2:18-24, and others. True, they also encourage masters not to mistreat their slaves. But, no where do they say that slaveholding is, itself, wrong. In fact, by deliniating what the relationship between Christian slave and Christian master ought to be, written under direct inspiration from God, and transcribed inerrantly into Holy Scripture, they were sanctifying the intstitution of slavery.

There are three ways to deal with this problem: (1) If the Bible is the total, and unquestionably, inspired, inerrant, Word of the Living God; and if we are truly a Christian nation, and if all our laws derive directly from the Bible, then all black people have to get back to the plantation quick or risk offending God with their freedom. The rest of us have to force our politicians to expunge all mention of equal rights from the constitution. As matter of fact, I think the Republicans are working on that right now! (2) Christians find a way to play down, explain away, or totally ignore these passages, and go on believing that Jesus sets people free, without actually, physically, doing it. (3) And this is the one I prefer, we chuck the whole damn book because what it comes down to is this: millions of Africans were made to suffer, and hundreds of thousands of Americans had to die before we finally, belatedly, get our morals straight about what the Bible said was perfectly okay.

Helpmabob

Hi JPD – Some questions are difficult for me to address in text without implying some form of dislike in the response. For what it is worth, I bear absolutely no such dislike towards you or any others here, I merely hold opposing views.

Hi John – post #148 sums it up for me. Christ offers freedom from the Old Testament rules and methods of living.

Arriccio – That is not all the bible says, it says much, much more. And, remember - There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven: [Ecclesiastes 3:1] All your quotes are from OT times, in the NT, the bible also says that he who would be greatest in the kingdom of heaven is to be a servant.

John A. Broussard

What you said there was:

Not by any stretch of the imagination is that an answer to:

"What rule(s) do you follow?"

When you were asked which verses are "rules" and which are "commandments."

Please try again.

Thank you.

Joan of Bark

Helpmabob, AGAIN I say (and I'm always being ignored by Christians on this point), if the Bible is the word of God why didn't he make the rules contained therein so clear there could be no room for debate? Is he not omnipotent and omniscient?

Helpmabob

Hi John - I am not sure what you mean. Please tell me what rules you follow, and I will know what form of answer you are looking for.

Hi Joan of B - If you want to know why God does something, I say it is not really for us to know the mind of God, or give him advice; a full scientific standard reply cannot be given on this matter of why. If you want to know what God does, has done, and will do, that is a different kettle of fish entirely, and one which I could attempt to answer at least in part.

Boro Nut

Steady on Joan. Adolf Hitler is widely regarded by many leading experts as probably the single most outstanding fascist dictator of Nazi Germany during the entire second world war, but was equally appalling at dictating letters, especially concerning key strategy matters such as invading neighbouring countries to conduct mass exterminations, preferring instead to throw a wobbler and threaten everybody in range with unspeakable things when his tea wasn’t just how he liked it. It’s hardly surprising the poor Germans thought he was god.

Boro Nut

John A. Broussard

Let's go back to the original post that inspired all this.


How do we, generally speaking, distinguish biblical guidelines from commands?

What I'm asking for is: "What are the rules that one should follow in order to distinguish biblical guidelines from commands?"

You posted several replies, none of which included and answer to the question: "What are the rules that one should follow in order to distinguish biblical guidelines from commands?"

Would you care to try again?

John A. Broussard

What god has done: Genocide. God wiped out everyone except for one family. That far exceeds the feats of any geocidal madman or madwoman since that time. God also encouraged his chosen people to ravage the countryside, killing everyone except for virgin girls to be saved for later raping by the victorious soldiers. In his spare time god also ordered a father to kill his own son.

What god does: How about hurricane Katrina, the Kashmiri eartquake, and the Indian Ocean tsunami?

What god will do: Above are some hints.