ohmi

In particular one might note that the powers-that-be had at the time [and still have] a vested interest in destroying and/or confusing the evidence that shows that their renaming their paganised religion as 'christianity' is a scam to control the people ...

Roger Pearse

If one believes that conspiracy theory is an adequate substitute for lack of evidence for something contradicted by all the surviving evidence, yes.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

aa5874

And it did without Jesus.

Even if a person claims Jesus did exist, it was only after his death or disappearance that Christianity flourished.

Paul, based on the NT, spread Christianity with only revelations and the belief that Jesus ROSE from the DEAD.

The belief that Jesus ROSE from the DEAD, a non- event, is the most critical element for Christianity to flourish.

Look at 1 Corinthians 15.14:
And 1 Corinthian 15.17

ohmi

The persecution by Rome of the saints of the original Hebrew Christianity is well documented [not least the Roman crucifixion of Peter , whereupon Rome then claims he gave them authority!!] , and the differences between divided romanised religions and the scripture are immense ... that is indeed proof ... as is the complete destruction of the [only] seven churches of God [razed to the ground , and still ruins , now in modern Turkey]

Sheshbazzar

It requires no "conspiracy theory" to acknowledge the facts of Constantine's barbaric treatment of all Christians that were not submissive to his religious opinions and decrees.
These things are simple (and well documented) facts of the rise and dominion of Orthodox Christianity through the violent and brutal means of suppression, tyranny, and the murderous extermination of their fellow Christian believers. That is real history.

Doug Shaver

The ones who say they're the only true Christians are all wrong. The ones who say they are Christians are all right.

Agreed.

Agreed also. Christians are people who identify themselves as such.

As for myself, I won't be cursing them unless they go back to burning heretics Whatever lesser forms of disapproval I might express depends on which variety I'm talking about.

Solitary Man

You make the same mistake as Roger in favoring etic over emic identities, but backwards. They're both flawed from an anthropological perspective.

Roger Pearse

You will, of course, produce evidence for your claims...? :devil1:

No doubt you believe that every man who says he is honest is telling the truth, but sadly I am too cynical, when I observe evidence to the contrary, to ignore it.

ohmi

Scripture appears to differ on that :-

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

spamandham

Keep in mind that on this forum, "scripture" is simply a collection of ancient texts with no more authority than any other.